View Single Post
  #37  
January 20th, 2011, 08:35 AM
smt smt is offline
Mega Super Daddy
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,587
Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
Please, do explain your definition of a "being", if we are discussing definitions now. I don't see a being as a ball of cells.
I was using the term being as a thing which exists and could have been capable of brain function, but in this case, isn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
Why don't you believe in souls? I take it seriously because, though I don't believe in souls, I don't not believe in them either, so I use the term loosely. I have no evidence of a soul's existence, but also don't have evidence that it doesn't exist. So for the sake of argument, I try to see both sides of the matter.
I don't believe in souls for the same reason you probably don't believe in unicorns, fairies, cupids, Easter bunnies and leprechauns. There is no evidence of their existence. Sure, I suppose all those things could exist, but we have no reason to believe they do. We also have reasons to believe they don't exist. There is no rational reason to take them into account in any discussion. The fact that some people might believe that any of those things are real is irrelevant in absence of credible evidence of their existence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
But Nature does decide things. What decides if there will be a hurricane? An earthquake? What decides if you get a stomach virus?
"Deciding" requires consciousness. What you are referring to is purely causal effects of matter moving through reality. There is no decision involved because unconscious matter has no means of self-change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
I see no need to interfere with it in the sense of, and I loosely use this term, "playing God" over who can and cannot survive when under the circumstance of their time in the womb where they would "normally" survive.
I can see a reason to interfere... for example, when a woman doesn't desire to carry a pregnancy to term. Why not interfere? Let's also be clear... when you use the terms "who" and "they" you are referring to pronouns which assume a person in existence. My argument is that early in the pregnancy no such person exists.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
My definition of a child is simple. A human being that is unable to fully think through their actions and consequences and/or is not of a mature adult size.
Sorry, but you can't just define a "child" as a "human being" when the term human being is also in question. Let's agree that a child is a young human being. So, please give your definition of a human being. List some of the attributes of a human being that differentiate it from other organisms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
A child has a beating HUMAN heart, human DNA, and has or will have the ability to think rationally at some point in their life if carried to term and survives to adulthood without any type of brain damage or just plain immaturity. In that sense, an unborn child is still a child.
Ok, so let's work with that definition for now. I think we can remove the part about "will have the ability" because we are talking about a current state of existence, not the potential after further development. Even I would agree that a fertilized egg has the potential to become a full human being. That does not make a fertilized egg a human being. It would be better to work with the phrase "has the capacity" to discuss the current state of existence. But let's say that the definition of "child" means it has to have a beating heart. Are you fine with abortion before there is a beating heart?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KiwiMommy View Post
Technically I don't have the "authority" to speak about what other women feel, but I speak from my experience with my friend's feelings, as well as the fact that there is a "Recovering from an Abortion Loss" board on JM. Why would there be such a board (and coined with the term "Loss") if only "some" women feel upset about the choice? Most of the boards on JM are here because a significant amount of women experience the same thing.
It makes sense that a women that visits a "Recovering from an Abortion Loss" board would feel some sort of loss. Not all women have a need to visit such a board. It is sort of like the heart surgeon that seems the think everyone in the world has heart problems because that is all he ever sees. It may also be that women that had abortions don't need to feel badly about it and that what they are feeling is based on false ideas of the existence of human beings and improperly placed guilt.
Reply With Quote