Log In Sign Up

Aborting due to a fetal abnormality/saving the mother


Abortion Debate

This forum is for Abortion debate only. If you are highly sensitive about this topic, read at your own discretion.

Welcome to the JustMommies Message Boards.

We pride ourselves on having the friendliest and most welcoming forums for moms and moms to be! Please take a moment and register for free so you can be a part of our growing community of mothers. If you have any problems registering please drop an email to boards@justmommies.com.

Our community is moderated by our moderation team so you won't see spam or offensive messages posted on our forums. Each of our message boards is hosted by JustMommies hosts, whose names are listed at the top each board. We hope you find our message boards friendly, helpful, and fun to be on!

Reply Post New Topic
  Subscribe To Abortion Debate LinkBack Topic Tools Search this Topic Display Modes
  #1  
April 5th, 2008, 09:14 AM
^RaineDrop^'s Avatar Summer Raine is 1 YR OLD!
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Posts: 3,390
Send a message via AIM to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via MSN to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via Yahoo to ^RaineDrop^
I've thought about these things a lot, and in more detail this is what I'm asking:

If you were able to know exactly how your baby would turn out, and in this case severely deformed, or something like a vegetable, (or something to this effect,) would you terminate the pregnancy or have it and do the best you can?
My stance on this one: this is the only case that has ever made me even CONSIDER abortion. Usually I say, it's not the baby's fault, it's not fair, etc, but in this case I really think that forcing it to live could be the greater evil. I mean, what kind of real LIFE can such a child have? It might not even reach adulthood, and if it does I'm sure it'll be nothing short of EXTREMELY difficult, not only for the person but the family and potential friends...

Next question:
If you were informed during labor that you had to make the choice: either you survive or your baby survives, (and no c-section could be done, because this defeats the purpose of the question,) would you choose you, or baby? How would you discuss this decision (quickly) with your husband/boyfriend/etc? Do you feel that anyone who chooses themselves is selfish or awful, or is it only human and should be accepted?
As far as this one goes, I'd probably choose baby.. I dunno, of course I would want to live, and I wouldn't want to leave my husband behind to raise our child on his own, but I don't think I could "live with" myself if I let the baby die.. =\ But I still just don't know, it's a moral dilemma if there ever was one that's for sure!
Actually I asked my husband this question, if I were unconsciousness and he had to make the decision for us, what would he do.. He said a fair amount of "Oh mans" and "I dunnos" and finally said his piece by explaining that he would probably choose me to live because he doesn't think he could give the baby the kind of life it deserves, him being a single teen parent who's dealing with grief on top of it all. I really understood his reasons, but I still don't know what _I_ would do..


What about the rest of you?
__________________


MY HOME WATER BIRTH WAS AMAZING

www.momentsbyheather.com
Reply With Quote
  #2  
April 5th, 2008, 03:17 PM
plan4fate's Avatar I may bend, but not break
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 26,080
Send a message via MSN to plan4fate
If you were able to know exactly how your baby would turn out, and in this case severely deformed, or something like a vegetable, (or something to this effect,) would you terminate the pregnancy or have it and do the best you can?

yes I would. I say this because of family experience. One of my aunts cannot have girls due to tay sachs. My cousin was just informed her daughter has battens disease and will not live to see adolescence and has to deal with painful seizures. Knowing what they're going through, I would not want to have to life with that.

Next question:
If you were informed during labor that you had to make the choice: either you survive or your baby survives, (and no c-section could be done, because this defeats the purpose of the question,) would you choose you, or baby? How would you discuss this decision (quickly) with your husband/boyfriend/etc? Do you feel that anyone who chooses themselves is selfish or awful, or is it only human and should be accepted?

That's a very tough one. One I actually don't think I could answer.
__________________
~TTC #1 together 2 years and counting ~


Awesome siggy made by Jaidynsmum
Matthew and Mark 08/24/2005 9w1d, Mattie Anne 04/07/2008 8w Mel and Dee 01/19/2010 (8 weeks) and 5 chemical pregnancies
Hope 07/22/2012@4w1d,Konnor 11/24/2012@3w6d,"Emmy"1/15/2013@ 3w6d,Ronen 02/10/2013@3w5d,Joy 07/19/2013@3w6d, "Pea" 09/06/2013@ 3w3d


Hashimoto's Thyroiditis, PCOS, Insulin resistant.
150mcg Synthyroid, 500mg Metformin (aiming for 1500mg)
Reply With Quote
  #3  
April 5th, 2008, 07:45 PM
Mom2DavidandAaron's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Mexico City
Posts: 3,227
Because of my religion,. I believe that abortion is aceptable when the life of the mother is at stake.
As for fetal abnormalities, well that depends on what you mean by that. If by "abnormality" you mean a condition like Down's syndrome or cerebral palsy. If we're talking about an abnormality that makes the baby non viable, then yes.

Sharon
Reply With Quote
  #4  
April 5th, 2008, 07:50 PM
rose198172's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 19,638
Quote:
Because of my religion,. I believe that abortion is acceptable when the life of the mother is at stake.
As for fetal abnormalities, well that depends on what you mean by that. If by "abnormality" you mean a condition like Down's syndrome or cerebral palsy. If we're talking about an abnormality that makes the baby non viable, then yes.

Sharon[/b]
Ditto.
__________________
Writer, Navy wife, autistic mom of two autistic kids (E is 6, C is 5).

Reply With Quote
  #5  
April 6th, 2008, 12:42 AM
^RaineDrop^'s Avatar Summer Raine is 1 YR OLD!
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Posts: 3,390
Send a message via AIM to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via MSN to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via Yahoo to ^RaineDrop^
By abnormality I guess what I had in mind was severe deformities or something else extreme, nothing like CP that can be lived with successfully.
__________________


MY HOME WATER BIRTH WAS AMAZING

www.momentsbyheather.com
Reply With Quote
  #6  
April 6th, 2008, 04:43 PM
mommyKathyX3
Guest
Posts: n/a
First instance, no I wouldnt abort.

Second instance, I cant really answer completley unless I was in that instance which I hope to GOD I never will be. I think generally speaking if my life was in iminant danger yes, I would probably abort ONLY because I have other children, and I think they deserve to have a mother at least instead of not a sibling OR a mother.

Reply With Quote
  #7  
April 6th, 2008, 06:41 PM
Default User's Avatar Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 371
If you were able to know exactly how your baby would turn out, and in this case severely deformed, or something like a vegetable, (or something to this effect,) would you terminate the pregnancy or have it and do the best you can?

I would abort. I don't think this is anything anybody should have to justify. It's one of those things that nobody has the right to judge another for what they do in this sort of situation. It's a hard choice, a very hard choice, probably the hardest choice anybody would ever have to make in their whole life. And it's one of those things that nobody has the right to second guess... To say they would or wouldn't do the same in the same situation, or they would or wouldn't do this or that... I think that we all know our limitations in this department, moreso than anybody else could presume to know.

If you were informed during labor that you had to make the choice: either you survive or your baby survives, (and no c-section could be done, because this defeats the purpose of the question,) would you choose you, or baby? How would you discuss this decision (quickly) with your husband/boyfriend/etc? Do you feel that anyone who chooses themselves is selfish or awful, or is it only human and should be accepted?

My mother was actually told when she was going into labor with me that this was a choice that she may have to make... I was a kneeling knee/ankle lock breech birth, the first that hospital had ever had. Everybody was super scared, they had to find a specialist and have him fly from across the country... My mother couldn't travel (of course), and they actually had her in some special cradle bed with her head pointed down to the floor so that she wouldn't go into labor. She was told that she may have to choose between me and her. She talked about it with my dad, and she desperately wanted me over her. However, when it came time, my father told the doctor that the choice was her over me.

This, like the situation above, I think is one of those things that you just can't know until you get into the situation yourself, and you can't judge what others would do because, well, you're not there. So you can't know.

(And by "you," I'm talking the generic "you," not any "you" in specific)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
April 6th, 2008, 09:55 PM
^RaineDrop^'s Avatar Summer Raine is 1 YR OLD!
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Posts: 3,390
Send a message via AIM to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via MSN to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via Yahoo to ^RaineDrop^
mommyKathyx3 - Why do you say no to the first?

Mrs. Stepford - That situation sounds CRAZY, what ended up happening? Obviously you are here today thank goodness but what actually went on?
__________________


MY HOME WATER BIRTH WAS AMAZING

www.momentsbyheather.com
Reply With Quote
  #9  
April 7th, 2008, 07:04 AM
Default User's Avatar Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 371
Quote:
Mrs. Stepford - That situation sounds CRAZY, what ended up happening? Obviously you are here today thank goodness but what actually went on?[/b]
Well, the whole story is that my mother went for a regular doctors appointment because she felt "weird." They did an ultrasound and found out what position I was in, and the doctor made an appointment to go to a larger hospital the next day to be evaulated. However, that night my mother started having contractions. She went to the hospital and found out that she was in early labor. Her water hadn't broken, but she was beginning to dialate. Because my mother gave birth to my sister in 45 minutes (counting from first contraction to delivery), the doctors were really worried about how things would go down. They called a specialist who was in Boston, but there were none available, and my mother couldn't be transported because they worried it'd push her to active labor. They finally found one from Florida who was available to help deliver me, but it was going to take 12ish hours just for him to get to my mother. So they admitted her to the maternity ward, and they gave her an IV to stop labor. Since the drug doesn't always stop labor when the process has started, they wanted to take the pressure off of her cervix, hoping that gravity would at least keep her from dialating further, so they put her in this reverse recline bed, where her head was pointed at the floor. Every hour or so, they'd let her sit upright again to help with the flow of blood, but she says she spent a majority of her time laying like she was on a slide. And she was told, under no circumstance, was she to push or try to push.

She said the worst was the parade of doctors coming in, telling her what they'd do if the doctor didn't make it, that at best they thought they'd deliver me via hysterectomy... Meaning they'd do a hysterectomy and take me out after the hysterectomy. Of course, that'd mean my mother could never have more kids, but because I was a kneeling knee/ankle lock breech, I couldn't be turned. At worst, they'd lose my mother and/or me, especially if she went into actual labor. She insists that she and my father agreed that if it came down to choosing, it'd be me over her (though she says the doctors heavily pressured her to choose her over me). My father insists that she said he could make the final determination should the question come up. Knowing my parents, my mother told my father what she wanted and would hear of nothing else, and my passive-aggressive father disagreed and was looking for a reason or a loophole to do what he thought was best without crossing my mother. My mother's rationale was that she'd wanted me and they'd tried for me for so long that it was her duty to sacrafice her life for mine. My father's rationale was that she was not replaceable, and while he loved me and wanted me, he didn't think it was fair to deny my older sister a mother in exchange for a sister.

She also said that, because it was a teaching hospital, and a kneeling breech is so rare, they had parades of people coming in to see her. It was one of only a couple kneeling breech births the hospital had ever had, and the first (and to this day only, even 26 years later) kneeling knee/ankle lock breech. They told my mother that for many of the doctors, they'd never see such a thing ever again. She said it was utterly humiliating.

After a day, the doctor they were waiting for showed up. The doctor was able to deliver me in an emergency c-section in less than 2 minutes because in an initial exam done by the him, he determined that the hospital gave her too much of the medicaiton designed to stop labor, and my O2 levels were dangerously low, and had been for some time. He was worried that, because I wasn't moving and my heartrate was low and my O2 sat was almost nothing, that I was in distress. He delivered me, and my APGAR at birth was 2, and because my knees and shin had been wedged past the cervix, my mother was bleeding very heavily. I guess the doctor in the hospital pushed for a hysterectomy to save my mother, but the other doctor did something else (I have no idea what it is, but I know she had to have another procedure in a couple of weeks to follow up what he did... So maybe some sort of stitches?) to try and save the uterus. At the time, even though they save the uterus, they didn't know if my mother could have kids anymore, but the doctor who they sent for said it was better to leave it and see then to take it out if they didn't have to... And he felt he didn't have to.

My 10 minute APGAR was a 4, and my 15 was 5, and my 30 was 10, so obviously I got better. My mother, though, stayed in the hospital for a week. After a week, she was sent home to bedrest, but she was back in three days because she says she had something called "milk fever" caused by an infection. She was really sick, with a fever of over 107 and she actually went unconscious for 22 hours. Neither my father or my mother will say it was a coma, but when one goes unconscious after a high fever for 22 hours... That's called a coma. She was in the hospital for another week, because the first treatment she was given didn't fix the problem, but actually made it worse. She was, again, a stop on the hospital doctor tour because she was one of the few (and the last in the history of the hospital) to get sick with what she had.

She was told at the time that she probably couldn't have anymore kids, but she got pregnant with my brother 3 years later... But after that, she was never on birth control again and she never got pregnant. In fact she was never on birth control after my birth, and it took 3 years to get pregnant with my brother. So it seems pretty clear that at some point, she was injured enough to never have anymore kids.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
April 8th, 2008, 06:43 AM
WNK's Avatar
WNK WNK is offline
Veteran
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 353
First instance, no, I would not abort. I have known many people with what could have been called "fetal abnormalities" (Dows' Syndrome, etc.) that have gone on to live full, happy lives. I think it's somewhat presumptuous of people to place a value on someone else's life before they've even had a chance to live it.

Second instance, this is definitely something that I plan on talking about with my DH before the situation ever would even arise. I think it's important to have at least a general idea of what each person thinks before actually getting into the situation, when emotions take over. But then again, you never really know until you're in that position.
__________________
<div align="center"> </div>
Reply With Quote
  #11  
April 8th, 2008, 08:41 AM
plan4fate's Avatar I may bend, but not break
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 26,080
Send a message via MSN to plan4fate
Quote:
First instance, no, I would not abort. I have known many people with what could have been called "fetal abnormalities" (Dows' Syndrome, etc.) that have gone on to live full, happy lives. I think it's somewhat presumptuous of people to place a value on someone else's life before they've even had a chance to live it[/b]
The question isn't about livable deformities or disorders, it's about ones that give the child a death sentence, or to be on support for the rest of their life. Non viable children basically.

Think Tay Sachs for example. These babies do not live to see their 5th birthdays, and lose muscle coordination very quickly. It is fatal, and for some it's painful.
Or Battens Disease. These children can actually live normal lives, except they suffer from severe seizures that cannot be controlled, they eventually lose the ability to move, or talk, but their brains still function. These are the "trapped in a dead body" children. My 2nd cousin's daughter was diagnosed with this last week, after being told for nearly 2 years she had Eplipesy. Instead they've had to watch their 4 year old lose the ability to walk (she can still crawl, but her ankles have stopped working), she can't form sentences anymore, just simple words, and she's lost her ability to look up or down or side to side (with out moving her head) all in the run of a week. Her parents have said that if they happen to get pregnant (they recently had started ttc) they will be doing a full fetal genetic profile and if the child has this, they will abort (they are pro life, that's why Averee is here in the first place). This child has indicated she's in pain, she's having 3-4 full seizures a day, she's battered and bruised from bumping into things she can't get away from.

Would you want to bring a child into the world, knowing for sure they're going to die a slow and painful death that CANNOT be medicated?
__________________
~TTC #1 together 2 years and counting ~


Awesome siggy made by Jaidynsmum
Matthew and Mark 08/24/2005 9w1d, Mattie Anne 04/07/2008 8w Mel and Dee 01/19/2010 (8 weeks) and 5 chemical pregnancies
Hope 07/22/2012@4w1d,Konnor 11/24/2012@3w6d,"Emmy"1/15/2013@ 3w6d,Ronen 02/10/2013@3w5d,Joy 07/19/2013@3w6d, "Pea" 09/06/2013@ 3w3d


Hashimoto's Thyroiditis, PCOS, Insulin resistant.
150mcg Synthyroid, 500mg Metformin (aiming for 1500mg)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
April 14th, 2008, 09:48 AM
Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hudson, MA
Posts: 12,814
To the first question - yes and it would be the hardest thing I would ever have to do, but I could not bring a child into this world knowing that it was only going to suffer. I have a friend who found out at her big ultrasound that her baby had all sorts of genetic disorders (I don't remember the specific names) one that would the child would probably be genderless and also that the baby's heart was not growing at the same rate and more than likely the baby wouldn't make it through labor and delivery because the heart would cease working. She felt she had no choice than to end that pregnancy as soon as possible. It was very heartbreaking for everyone, but she knew deep down it was the right decision and I would have to make the same one.

As far as the second question... I don't know. I hate to even think of it. I think I would want the baby saved over me because I don't know if I could deal with the grief, which is really selfish of me!
__________________







Reply With Quote
  #13  
April 16th, 2008, 12:10 AM
^RaineDrop^'s Avatar Summer Raine is 1 YR OLD!
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Posts: 3,390
Send a message via AIM to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via MSN to ^RaineDrop^ Send a message via Yahoo to ^RaineDrop^
Oh wow Mrs. Stepford that's quite a situation! Sorry about the late response, I lost track of this thread..

I think everyone's hit it on the head, I think it would be hard for anyone to disagree!
__________________


MY HOME WATER BIRTH WAS AMAZING

www.momentsbyheather.com
Reply With Quote
  #14  
April 25th, 2008, 07:37 PM
Little Mrs Sunshine
Guest
Posts: n/a
i believe in abortions for medical purposes such as nonviable children or high risk of death to the mother during childbirth. I have kids who are already here who need me. It would still be a painful thing to live with making that choice though. my answer may or may not have been different if it were my first child. Id have to walk in those shoes before I could open my mouth on that.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
April 30th, 2008, 07:51 PM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: ohio
Posts: 3,657
Yes to both.... it's unfair to the child and surviving family members no matter what happens
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #16  
June 15th, 2008, 09:25 PM
~Carissa~'s Avatar SAHMommy to Wyatt!
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Southeast USA
Posts: 4,757
Send a message via AIM to ~Carissa~
Quote:
To the first question - yes and it would be the hardest thing I would ever have to do, but I could not bring a child into this world knowing that it was only going to suffer. I have a friend who found out at her big ultrasound that her baby had all sorts of genetic disorders (I don't remember the specific names) one that would the child would probably be genderless and also that the baby's heart was not growing at the same rate and more than likely the baby wouldn't make it through labor and delivery because the heart would cease working. She felt she had no choice than to end that pregnancy as soon as possible. It was very heartbreaking for everyone, but she knew deep down it was the right decision and I would have to make the same one.[/b]
Reading that made me cry, because I went through a VERY
similar situation back in 06. It was the worst situation I have
EVER been in...hands down. It can't even be imagined or
explained really.
__________________
Wyatt







Reply With Quote
  #17  
June 16th, 2008, 12:04 PM
Fluffy Baby's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: SW FL
Posts: 8,785
First instance- Yes I would. Hardest decision ever.

Second instance- I would probably have to say I would want to live. Again, hardest things ever, but that isn't fair to my DD and my DH. My DD needs her mommy. My husband and I have already talked about it. We both agree, that I would be the more logical choice. Not the easiest, but most logical.
__________________
Leann <3 Hector
My trio: Alyssa 7, Tristan 4.75, Gavin 1.5

I am a mixture of all that and a bag of chips... IJS



Rest In Peace Jennifer <3



Reply With Quote
  #18  
June 18th, 2008, 02:19 PM
Mud235's Avatar Super Mom Extrodinaire
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,331
Quote:
If you were able to know exactly how your baby would turn out, and in this case severely deformed, or something like a vegetable, (or something to this effect,) would you terminate the pregnancy or have it and do the best you can?[/b]
I would abort. No reason to cause untold grief on yourself and family and the baby.

Quote:
If you were informed during labor that you had to make the choice: either you survive or your baby survives, (and no c-section could be done, because this defeats the purpose of the question,) would you choose you, or baby? How would you discuss this decision (quickly) with your husband/boyfriend/etc? Do you feel that anyone who chooses themselves is selfish or awful, or is it only human and should be accepted?[/b]
I would choose myself. It would be hard to do, but I have another child at home that I will never abandon if I can help it. Plus is it fair to the siblings that the mother choose the baby over herself?
__________________
Stefanie
(formerly HPGeek)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
June 19th, 2008, 09:37 AM
Veteran
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Florida
Posts: 224
for the first question- I would choose to abort.
for the second question- I would choose to abort. What kind of life would the baby have with no mother and a heartbroken single father?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
July 10th, 2008, 07:37 AM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: May 2007
Location: WV
Posts: 1,624
Send a message via AIM to Tania_Marie Send a message via MSN to Tania_Marie
I too would abort on both questions. I do not think it is fair to the fetus to suffer. I think without medical intervention, most very sick fetuses would pass on anyways.

I have two babies already that need me. I could not leave them.
__________________
<div align="center"></div>
<div align="center">


</div>
Reply With Quote
Reply

Topic Tools Search this Topic
Search this Topic:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 09:38 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0