Log In Sign Up

Your Stance


Abortion Debate

This forum is for Abortion debate only. If you are highly sensitive about this topic, read at your own discretion.

Welcome to the JustMommies Message Boards.

We pride ourselves on having the friendliest and most welcoming forums for moms and moms to be! Please take a moment and register for free so you can be a part of our growing community of mothers. If you have any problems registering please drop an email to boards@justmommies.com.

Our community is moderated by our moderation team so you won't see spam or offensive messages posted on our forums. Each of our message boards is hosted by JustMommies hosts, whose names are listed at the top each board. We hope you find our message boards friendly, helpful, and fun to be on!

View Poll Results: Pro-Choice or Pro-Life?
Pro-Choice 92 51.11%
Pro-Life 77 42.78%
Other (please explain) 11 6.11%
Voters: 180. You may not vote on this poll

Like Tree2Likes

Reply Post New Topic
  Subscribe To Abortion Debate LinkBack Topic Tools Search this Topic Display Modes
  #41  
March 26th, 2010, 12:41 PM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
What is there to not understand? If someone wants to remain in control of their autonomy while pregnant, then they can't advocate for stripping someone else's.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #42  
March 26th, 2010, 05:41 PM
WineKeepsMeSane's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: May 2007
Location: where chili has beans
Posts: 13,348
I don't think that saying you can have an abortion if you choose to do so under circumstances a,b,c is at all the same as saying you MUST have an abortion under circumstances abc or even x,y,z.
__________________
Ashley, mommy to Mackenzie 01/01/08

Reply With Quote
  #43  
March 26th, 2010, 06:56 PM
Tofu Bacon
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
What is there to not understand? If someone wants to remain in control of their autonomy while pregnant, then they can't advocate for stripping someone else's.
^^Ditto, which is why I consider myself pro-choice.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
March 26th, 2010, 07:50 PM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by amegra View Post
I don't think that saying you can have an abortion if you choose to do so under circumstances a,b,c is at all the same as saying you MUST have an abortion under circumstances abc or even x,y,z.
Again, who is going to decide if the circumstances warrant an abortion? Not the mother. I'm pro-CHOICE because I want every woman to have the CHOICE of handling their pregnancies however they see fit. That includes CHOOSING to carry the pregnancy to term. By allowing a law that essentially removes the right of a woman to her own uterus, it opens the door to a whole slew of consequences.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #45  
March 26th, 2010, 09:00 PM
(.Y.)mom2dd(.Y.)
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
Again, who is going to decide if the circumstances warrant an abortion? Not the mother. I'm pro-CHOICE because I want every woman to have the CHOICE of handling their pregnancies however they see fit. That includes CHOOSING to carry the pregnancy to term. By allowing a law that essentially removes the right of a woman to her own uterus, it opens the door to a whole slew of consequences.
Reply With Quote
  #46  
March 28th, 2010, 03:41 PM
WineKeepsMeSane's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: May 2007
Location: where chili has beans
Posts: 13,348
Still don't buy it. There are plenty of surgeries and procedures that the medical profession sets out guidelines on - about whether we CAN have them because the situation warrants it, not that we MUST have them. There is a difference.
__________________
Ashley, mommy to Mackenzie 01/01/08

Reply With Quote
  #47  
March 28th, 2010, 03:53 PM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by amegra View Post
Still don't buy it. There are plenty of surgeries and procedures that the medical profession sets out guidelines on - about whether we CAN have them because the situation warrants it, not that we MUST have them. There is a difference.
Weren't you one of the ones who vehemently disagreed with a court order forcing a patient to undergo chemotherapy? Obviously, the government is entirely capable of making decisions for those who do not have the rights to their own autonomy. This has ZERO to do with medical community guidelines.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #48  
March 29th, 2010, 12:53 PM
(.Y.)mom2dd(.Y.)
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by amegra View Post
Still don't buy it. There are plenty of surgeries and procedures that the medical profession sets out guidelines on - about whether we CAN have them because the situation warrants it, not that we MUST have them. There is a difference.
Ashley, choice is something I value greatly. I can't imagine forcing a woman to stay pregnant when she can abort. Even if you don't agree with plastic surgery, if a person is willing to get cosmetic surgery done, why should they be denied?
Reply With Quote
  #49  
March 30th, 2010, 05:04 AM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: australia
Posts: 941
pro choice here. i have my own body and i am in charge of it and nobody will influence any decisions i make for my body.
__________________
you laugh at me because im differnt, i laugh at your because your all the same


monkey n mum
Reply With Quote
  #50  
March 30th, 2010, 12:30 PM
IAmMomMomIAm
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
Weren't you one of the ones who vehemently disagreed with a court order forcing a patient to undergo chemotherapy? Obviously, the government is entirely capable of making decisions for those who do not have the rights to their own autonomy. This has ZERO to do with medical community guidelines.
Ah.. okay, when you think about a case by case basis, your argument makes more sense. What I don't understand was the jump from "abortion is illegal" to "abortion is mandatory." However, even now they can "force" someone to get an abortion. For instance, if a 17-year-old has a mental disability and isn't competent to make her own medical decisions, and her parents want her to have an abortion, the court can rule that she have an abortion, whether she wants it or not.. just like they can force someone to have chemo.

I guess I still don't understanding the thought process behind the jump from illegal to mandatory. Is it just a matter of principle? Or do you actually believe that making abortion illegal will lead to forced abortions?
Reply With Quote
  #51  
March 30th, 2010, 03:12 PM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keskes View Post
Ah.. okay, when you think about a case by case basis, your argument makes more sense. What I don't understand was the jump from "abortion is illegal" to "abortion is mandatory." However, even now they can "force" someone to get an abortion. For instance, if a 17-year-old has a mental disability and isn't competent to make her own medical decisions, and her parents want her to have an abortion, the court can rule that she have an abortion, whether she wants it or not.. just like they can force someone to have chemo.

I guess I still don't understanding the thought process behind the jump from illegal to mandatory. Is it just a matter of principle? Or do you actually believe that making abortion illegal will lead to forced abortions?
It's mostly principle, but I do worry about cases like the situation you presented. For example, if a woman is placing her life at risk by carrying to term, can her husband pursue a court-order to have the pregnancy terminated? There are just too many possibilities once we take that choice away from the mother.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #52  
March 31st, 2010, 04:48 PM
WineKeepsMeSane's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: May 2007
Location: where chili has beans
Posts: 13,348
Quote:
I guess I still don't understanding the thought process behind the jump from illegal to mandatory. Is it just a matter of principle? Or do you actually believe that making abortion illegal will lead to forced abortions?
This, which you already answered.

If it were made that someone could pursue an abortion for another person, then yes, that is a big problem. However, if abortions were only legal under certain circumstances, I would assume that it is still up to the woman, and the woman only, whether or not to have it. I don't dispute abortions when the mother's life is in imminent danger. However, it would still have to be her decision - just as I don't believe blood transfusions should be forced just because a doctor thinks the patient is in "imminent danger".
__________________
Ashley, mommy to Mackenzie 01/01/08

Reply With Quote
  #53  
March 31st, 2010, 06:21 PM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by amegra View Post
This, which you already answered.

If it were made that someone could pursue an abortion for another person, then yes, that is a big problem. However, if abortions were only legal under certain circumstances, I would assume that it is still up to the woman, and the woman only, whether or not to have it. I don't dispute abortions when the mother's life is in imminent danger. However, it would still have to be her decision - just as I don't believe blood transfusions should be forced just because a doctor thinks the patient is in "imminent danger".
You can't remove a woman's right to choice, and then assume she will retain that choice under certain circumstances, particularly when she has no say whatsoever whether the circumstances are valid. How would that even work for rape victims? Would the rapist need to be convicted in order for the government to agree a rape actually took place rather than a woman claiming rape in order to have an abortion? The baby would be born before the trial is even over.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #54  
April 8th, 2010, 08:34 AM
AMDG's Avatar Margaret
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Denver metro area
Posts: 2,988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
It's mostly principle, but I do worry about cases like the situation you presented. For example, if a woman is placing her life at risk by carrying to term, can her husband pursue a court-order to have the pregnancy terminated? There are just too many possibilities once we take that choice away from the mother.

I understand your argument but I think it is flawed. The reason people are against abortion or pro-life has nothing to do with the fact that they believe a woman's rights should be taken away etc. People are pro-life because they believe the unborn is a human person and has equal value to the life of the mother. Because of that belief, the life of one person (as it does in all cases of people already born) trumps anything less than the life of the mother. If it comes down to life vs. life they are exactly equal. So, any law to restrict abortion or outlaw abortion isn't about the taking away rights from someone but GIVING rights to someone and not letting another harm that life. I don't see how that fits at all with forcing an abortion on someone.
Obviously there is a fundumental disagreement about the value the fetus or unborn child has but the argument and whole issue is at its base about just that - the value of the unborn.
I would argue that having abortion be legal is what leads to the things you are concerned about because once life isn't valued as it should be then we open the door to letting the government or others decide what life has value, how much and when it has such value. Either all life has equal value or it doesn't and if it doesn't then who gets to decide what life is given what value? I think that is where things get scary.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
April 8th, 2010, 09:07 AM
**Badfish**'s Avatar Worth Saving
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 7,141
If we give a fetus rights, then where does that stop? There's no way to do it without stripping rights from the mother. Every thing that is considered risky during pregnancy and labor could be outlawed because it would be considered child endangerment. All of these choices we have during pregnancy and labor, like home births and epidurals, will be fair game for legislation.
__________________





Reply With Quote
  #56  
April 8th, 2010, 09:32 AM
(.Y.)mom2dd(.Y.)
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
If we give a fetus rights, then where does that stop? There's no way to do it without stripping rights from the mother. Every thing that is considered risky during pregnancy and labor could be outlawed because it would be considered child endangerment. All of these choices we have during pregnancy and labor, like home births and epidurals, will be fair game for legislation.
Not to mention, the mother is going to caring for this child. She will ultimately be determining the quality of life. Why can't she have the right to decide if she can even be a mother in the first place?
Reply With Quote
  #57  
April 8th, 2010, 12:18 PM
AMDG's Avatar Margaret
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Denver metro area
Posts: 2,988
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jess is Write View Post
If we give a fetus rights, then where does that stop? There's no way to do it without stripping rights from the mother. Every thing that is considered risky during pregnancy and labor could be outlawed because it would be considered child endangerment. All of these choices we have during pregnancy and labor, like home births and epidurals, will be fair game for legislation.

I agree that things might go down that road but I think it is an unfortunate consequence of the direction things are heading in our society. I would fight any legislation that you mention just as I would fight legislation that would limit a mother's right to home-school (with or without a degree) or legislation that would force vaccinations etc etc. There are so many irresponsible parents and unfortunately there are many - on this board included - who think that one way to solve that is turn some control over to the government.
Reply With Quote
  #58  
April 16th, 2010, 01:37 AM
Beneath_The_Rose's Avatar WTTC #1
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 331
Pro-choice.
__________________


still waters run deep


How easily the mind can be turned to hate from a place of fear - an instinctive, natural, protective response.
Instead of focusing on the things that unite us, we focus on what divides us
-Thrall


*FaceBook*
*Myspace*
Reply With Quote
  #59  
April 18th, 2010, 03:37 AM
beck12's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 12,330
I voted other. I don't honestly feel like I fit on either side of this. I also don't believe that laws are the way to handle this issue - because people will do what they are going to do - sooo.... I am not pro-life enough for many that call themselves pro-life because I don't support banning it & I am not pro-choice enough to say that I think abortion is a viable option. It is definitely something I disagree with - but I do understand why it might be sought & I don't judge another woman for it since I know her feelings on it may differ greatly from mine & she is making decisions based on her own life & her own feelings/perceptions, not mine.

So anyway - others can think I am this or that - for me - I feel neutral actually....since I don't think it's right yet I don't want to make it illegal. I could say the same for MANY other topics as well...there are a lot of things I think aren't right & I don't want to start legislating my beliefs about those things either.
__________________
B - Crazy momma to my two boys
We've begun to raise daughters more like sons... but few have the courage to raise our sons more like our daughters. ~Gloria Steinem

If a man has been his mother's undisputed darling he retains throughout life the triumphant feeling, the confidence in success, which not seldom brings actual success along with it. ~Sigmund Freud
My mom is a neverending song in my heart of comfort, happiness, and being. I may sometimes forget the words but I always remember the tune. ~Graycie Harmon
Don't wait to make your son a great man - make him a great boy. ~Author Unknown
You don't raise heroes, you raise sons. And if you treat them like sons, they'll turn out to be heroes, even if it's just in your own eyes. ~Walter M. Schirra, Sr.
A man loves his sweetheart the most, his wife the best, but his mother the longest. ~Irish Proverb
Mother's love is peace. It need not be acquired, it need not be deserved. ~Erich Fromm
Children need love, especially when they do not deserve it. - Harold Hulbert
Mother is the name for God in the lips and hearts of little children. ~William Makepeace Thackeray
God could not be everywhere, so he created mothers. ~Jewish Proverb
The best conversations with mothers always take place in silence, when only the heart speaks. ~Carrie Latet




Reply With Quote
  #60  
April 23rd, 2010, 07:59 AM
Veteran
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 254
Pro life.
__________________
Jackie married, Gabriela 01.03.2002 ,
Quentin 11.27.2008 Johanna 12.06.09
Sophia 01.01.2011, Maria 05.01.2012
Kathi 05.20.2013





Reply With Quote
Reply

Topic Tools Search this Topic
Search this Topic:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:50 PM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0