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Tubal Pregnancies


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  #1  
September 14th, 2006, 07:57 PM
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I've been debating this inside my head for a while now... If a person has a tubal pregnancy, but is 100% pro-life, what do you do?

I'm not terribly familiar with tubals, but isn't it basically next to impossible for the baby to live, and if the pregnancy continues--a good chance the mother will die?

I don't know what I would do.. I don't know how I could ever have an abortion, but if the baby is going to die anyways, should I let myself take that chance?

Thoughts??
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  #2  
September 14th, 2006, 08:01 PM
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It's a tough one for people who argue zygote/embryo right to life (those that argue right to life starts at conception). That clump of cells, to them, has a right to life. Does that right to life cease to exist by virtue of the cells implanting in the wrong area?
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  #3  
September 14th, 2006, 08:27 PM
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A tubal pregnancy NEVER survives & it likely kills the mother. The risk of death is very very high & the chance of viable pg from that is ZERO. It's not even close to a an abortion issue if you ask me - when the tube ruptures (which it will) it WILL kill the baby & probably mom too. What exactly seems like a choice there? It seems to be to be fairly obvious that you can either choose to die with your baby or live. There is NO question there on viability of the baby, the baby will die either way - no question. Ectopic pregnancy is still the leading cause of maternal death in 1st trimester & accounts for over 13% of all maternal deaths. IMO - that meaning to me - I would not have any issue personally knowing what is "right" in this case - as there is no good outcome any way you slice it...all you can do at that point is try to salvage your own life & possibly aid in preserving hte tube if possible.
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  #5  
September 15th, 2006, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
I wouldn't (and couldn't) fault anyone for it...because the baby seriously has NO percentage of living....(if we are talking about ectopic pregnancies...which are in the tubes, cervical lining, or ovaries).....There is NO way a baby can make it past even 10 weeks (probably sooner than that), without rupturing the tube/cervix/ovary....which will 100% kill the baby in the process, and put the mother in grave danger of hemorrhaging....

I - personally - would have an extremely hard time taking the surgery/meds.....

I actually was faced with the situation with my second son...they were ready to give me the meds right then and there...I had ALL the classic signs of ectopic pregnancy....low and dropping levels, extreme nausea (later diagnosed as repeat Hyperemesis), pain on one side (later diagnosed as the corpus luteum cyst), no visible intrauterine pregnancy, shoulder pain, spotting....But, I wouldn't take the medicine (which they were going to give me first, and if that didn't work then they were going to do the surgical procedure), and I demanded another ultrasound...I just couldn't do it....He ended up being safe and sound....

I really would have to have someone drug me up, (without me knowing)....to get me on that table again....[/b]
I can't believe they would have tried to diagnose an ectopic pregnacy without giving you an ultrasound first. That is horrible!!!

I had a VERIFIED ectopic pregnancy and they luckily caught it before it did any major damage to my tubes and before I needed surgery. I was able to take Methotrexate. I never ONCE felt like I was aborting my baby. It wasn't a viable pregnancy and it would have killed me and my baby if it was left untreated, or taken away the chance for me to try and have viable pregnancies. So, no, I don't consider it abortion, I consider it a medical treatment.
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  #6  
September 15th, 2006, 06:20 AM
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I don't think of a tubal pregnancy as an abortion. I agree that it is more of a medical treatment. As far as I know, they do the procedure in the hospital not an abortion clinic.
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  #7  
September 15th, 2006, 06:24 AM
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As one who has had an ectopic pregnancy - It is not an abortion. Often the child/fetus has passed prior to surgery. If not, the mother will surely die. It is a medical procedure to save the mother's life.

Please be aware that this is an extremely sensitive issue for the women who have been through it. Obviously, we have all thought about the fact that we possibly caused the death of our child. I understand that this a debate board but sensitivity to women who have gone through this terrible ordeal would be prudent.
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  #8  
September 15th, 2006, 06:35 AM
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WOuldn't this be an arguement against life beginning at conception? Between the idea of ectopic and the idea that up to half of all conceived embryos die before inplantation, how can we place the beginning of life at conception?
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  #10  
September 15th, 2006, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE
Quote:
I can't believe they would have tried to diagnose an ectopic pregnacy without giving you an ultrasound first. That is horrible!!!

I had a VERIFIED ectopic pregnancy and they luckily caught it before it did any major damage to my tubes and before I needed surgery. I was able to take Methotrexate. I never ONCE felt like I was aborting my baby. It wasn't a viable pregnancy and it would have killed me and my baby if it was left untreated, or taken away the chance for me to try and have viable pregnancies. So, no, I don't consider it abortion, I consider it a medical treatment.[/b]
No, they DID do an ultrasound...and there wasn't any visible intrauterine pregnancy found...so they just assumed that he was in my tubes....

I think that either I was too early to see anything (though with my second demanded ultrasound just a few days later they found him in my uterus), or that the radiologist/technician both needed some serious eye examinations....

So, yes, I did have an ultrasound...and nausea (later diagnosed as repeat Hyperemesis), low and dropping HcG levels (observed from the Quantative HcG testing), shoulder pain, pain on one side (later diagnosed to a corpus luteum cyst), slight spotting.....

I am just EXTREMELY grateful that I did demand that second ultrasound...(which they were hesistant to do).

I just want to clarify that I DON'T see the treatments as the same level that abortion is on....No. ESPECIALLY when, like someone else has stated, the baby has already died before treatment....

But ultimately, the guilt would overcome me....I have a hard enough time with the surgery that I DID go through...and that was "after" he died....so...I just don't think I could do the treatment while the baby was still living...at least not without some SERIOUS like force.....JMO.
[/b][/quote]

I'm sorry, I must have misread the post! I thought they wanted you to take treatment without ANY ultrasounds!
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  #12  
September 15th, 2006, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
A tubal pregnancy NEVER survives & it likely kills the mother. The risk of death is very very high & the chance of viable pg from that is ZERO. It's not even close to a an abortion issue if you ask me - when the tube ruptures (which it will) it WILL kill the baby & probably mom too. What exactly seems like a choice there? It seems to be to be fairly obvious that you can either choose to die with your baby or live. There is NO question there on viability of the baby, the baby will die either way - no question. Ectopic pregnancy is still the leading cause of maternal death in 1st trimester & accounts for over 13% of all maternal deaths. IMO - that meaning to me - I would not have any issue personally knowing what is "right" in this case - as there is no good outcome any way you slice it...all you can do at that point is try to salvage your own life & possibly aid in preserving hte tube if possible.[/b]
Actually, I saw a show on Discovery Health Channel where they followed a woman who's baby actually survived. It somehow bursted her tube, and then implanted on the outside of it---baby and mother both survived. That's why I was considering that there is an extremely slight chance that the baby could live. But I'm sure 99.9999999999% of the time, they would not.

Quote:
As one who has had an ectopic pregnancy - It is not an abortion. Often the child/fetus has passed prior to surgery. If not, the mother will surely die. It is a medical procedure to save the mother's life.

Please be aware that this is an extremely sensitive issue for the women who have been through it. Obviously, we have all thought about the fact that we possibly caused the death of our child. I understand that this a debate board but sensitivity to women who have gone through this terrible ordeal would be prudent.[/b]
Sorry if I offended you by posting this..
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  #14  
September 15th, 2006, 08:41 PM
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After reading all of your posts, I don't think I would consider it an abortion either. Although I would have a very hard time making that decision.

I think that I WOULD consider medical conditions where there is a very real chance that a baby would survive an abortion(like a 1 in 10 chance). I wouldn't fault anyone for making that decision though.
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  #16  
September 15th, 2006, 11:22 PM
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WOuldn't this be an arguement against life beginning at conception? Between the idea of ectopic and the idea that up to half of all conceived embryos die before inplantation, how can we place the beginning of life at conception?[/b]
That is a good question. I usually consider myself a person who beliefs that there is a life after conception. I will have to rethink it.
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  #17  
September 16th, 2006, 02:17 AM
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I consider a tubal pregnancy on the same level as a miscarriage - for whatever reason, the child probably wouldn't survive and that's why God ended the pregnancy. I am sorry if I offended anyone.

No, I don't think of it as abortion.
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  #18  
September 17th, 2006, 07:16 AM
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An abortion is the intentional killing of an unborn child.An ectopic tubal pregnancy as stated will not live if in the tube and could kill the mother as well.That is not an abortion.As christians we do believe that the ending of a nonviable ectopic pregnancy is not abortion in the actual meaning of an abortion.Alot of women have ectopic pregnancies and hate the thought of having to end the pregnancy because it is a baby, I would have a hard time dealing with it if it ever happened to me.I have had miscarriages and am now most likely having one at 5 weeks and when I go to the memorial pages to add a memorial for my losses, I always find alot of losses for ectopic babies as well who are being remembered by moms who are very upset about their experience because it was not a choice.
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  #19  
September 17th, 2006, 09:47 AM
beck12's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Quote:
WOuldn't this be an arguement against life beginning at conception? Between the idea of ectopic and the idea that up to half of all conceived embryos die before inplantation, how can we place the beginning of life at conception?[/b]
No - I don't think it's an argument against life at conception. I believe in life at conception - but in this particular case - this life is not viable if left alone & allowed to take course & will kill the mom. In abortion - typically you are speaking of a life that will thrive if left alone & allowed to take course. As far as half of all embryos "dying before implantation" - all that says to me is that an embryo is alive because you have to be alive in order to die. I only wish there will come a day when they can possibly take a tubal pg & find a way to transplant it into the uterus - but we are far from there at this point.
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We've begun to raise daughters more like sons... but few have the courage to raise our sons more like our daughters. ~Gloria Steinem

If a man has been his mother's undisputed darling he retains throughout life the triumphant feeling, the confidence in success, which not seldom brings actual success along with it. ~Sigmund Freud
My mom is a neverending song in my heart of comfort, happiness, and being. I may sometimes forget the words but I always remember the tune. ~Graycie Harmon
Don't wait to make your son a great man - make him a great boy. ~Author Unknown
You don't raise heroes, you raise sons. And if you treat them like sons, they'll turn out to be heroes, even if it's just in your own eyes. ~Walter M. Schirra, Sr.
A man loves his sweetheart the most, his wife the best, but his mother the longest. ~Irish Proverb
Mother's love is peace. It need not be acquired, it need not be deserved. ~Erich Fromm
Children need love, especially when they do not deserve it. - Harold Hulbert
Mother is the name for God in the lips and hearts of little children. ~William Makepeace Thackeray
God could not be everywhere, so he created mothers. ~Jewish Proverb
The best conversations with mothers always take place in silence, when only the heart speaks. ~Carrie Latet




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  #20  
September 17th, 2006, 09:52 AM
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Well, eacha nd every cell in your body is "alive"...I was speaking of "human life" beginning at conception.
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