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What if you don't have a reason for wanting an abortion


Abortion Debate

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  #1  
April 24th, 2007, 11:09 AM
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This is sort of a spinoff of one of the other topics- in reverse.

If you are pro-choice, what would you think of the following scenario:

A woman gets pregnant. She is in a relationship that is not abusive or damaging. Her family is not abusive. She won't lose her job if she continues her pregnancy. She has the financial resources to continue the pregnancy and/or keep the child. She is not an addict, she is perfectly healthy.

But she just doesn't want a child right now. She doesn't really have a reason why not. Do you think this is a good enough reason to have an abortion?
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  #2  
April 24th, 2007, 01:24 PM
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Well that is up to her.

I don't tell people what a good reason is or isn't,it simply isn't my place too. Not wanting to be a mother for whatever reason is a good enough reason to abort. I may not like the idea,but it isn't my place to tell a women that she should or shouldn't abort.

People abort because they do not want a child,don't want to go through with a pregnancy etc so why wouldn't a women not wanting to be a mum for ANY reason make that a bad reason to abort? Isn't that what abortion is anyway? Ending a pregnancy because women doesn't want a child.

I do not get to choose what is a valid reason for abortion.
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  #3  
April 24th, 2007, 01:46 PM
mrobinson
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This is sort of a spinoff of one of the other topics- in reverse.

If you are pro-choice, what would you think of the following scenario:

A woman gets pregnant. She is in a relationship that is not abusive or damaging. Her family is not abusive. She won't lose her job if she continues her pregnancy. She has the financial resources to continue the pregnancy and/or keep the child. She is not an addict, she is perfectly healthy.

But she just doesn't want a child right now. She doesn't really have a reason why not. Do you think this is a good enough reason to have an abortion?[/b]
The options are forcing a woman to have child she doesn't want or have an abortion? I think it's a "good enough" reason to have an abortion.
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  #4  
April 24th, 2007, 01:58 PM
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Who says this isn't a valid reason? If a woman doesn't want to be a mother, doesn't want to be pregnant, for whatever reason, the choice to abort is between her and her doctor.
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  #6  
April 24th, 2007, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
This is sort of a spinoff of one of the other topics- in reverse.

If you are pro-choice, what would you think of the following scenario:

A woman gets pregnant. She is in a relationship that is not abusive or damaging. Her family is not abusive. She won't lose her job if she continues her pregnancy. She has the financial resources to continue the pregnancy and/or keep the child. She is not an addict, she is perfectly healthy.

But she just doesn't want a child right now. She doesn't really have a reason why not. Do you think this is a good enough reason to have an abortion?[/b]
If the reason for an abortion is "good enough" to the woman who wants one, it should be good enough for everyone else. It's her body, and her choice and no one else should have any say as to what is an acceptable reason.
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  #7  
April 24th, 2007, 07:57 PM
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The options are forcing a woman to have child she doesn't want or have an abortion? I think it's a "good enough" reason to have an abortion.[/b]
That's how I feel too.
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  #9  
April 24th, 2007, 09:30 PM
irishxrose
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Her choice. She still has that legal right in this country (although for how long I'm not sure considering who we have on our Supreme Court )
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  #10  
April 24th, 2007, 10:03 PM
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It's her body so it's her choice. Who am I to judge what choice a woman makes when it comes to her body?[/b]
But it's NOT just her body. It is her baby's body she's killing! The baby has no choice...
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  #11  
April 25th, 2007, 12:31 AM
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Quote:
It's her body so it's her choice. Who am I to judge what choice a woman makes when it comes to her body?[/b]
But it's NOT just her body. It is her baby's body she's killing! The baby has no choice...
[/b]
You say baby,I say fetus. Who is right?

It is a matter of OPINION at the end of the day.
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  #13  
April 25th, 2007, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(coughburp @ Apr 24 2007, 07:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
<div class='quotemain'>
It's her body so it's her choice. Who am I to judge what choice a woman makes when it comes to her body?[/b]
But it's NOT just her body. It is her baby's body she's killing! The baby has no choice...
[/b]
You say baby,I say fetus. Who is right?

It is a matter of OPINION at the end of the day.
[/b][/quote]
Correction, you say 'clump of cells'.
[/b][/quote]

Correction. I say both Did I see MY children as a clump of cells? YES but I still loved them from the moment I got the positive result.
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  #14  
April 25th, 2007, 10:44 AM
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No reason is 'good enough' in my eyes. Some are UNDERSTANABLE, but still not a valid reason (IMO) to kill a baby.

Flame away.[/b]
Well, thankfully, there are still some members of the Supreme Court that don't share the same viewpoint as you. You can call it a baby all day if you want to, that doesn't change the fact that it's a fetus and it's incapable of living outside of the mother's body, and therefore it is still her body and her choice as to whether to terminate the pregnancy.
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  #15  
April 25th, 2007, 11:47 AM
Caeden&#39;sMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
It's her body so it's her choice. Who am I to judge what choice a woman makes when it comes to her body?[/b]
But it's NOT just her body. It is her baby's body she's killing! The baby has no choice...
[/b]
You say baby,I say fetus. Who is right?

It is a matter of OPINION at the end of the day.
[/b]
Fetus or baby, you're not seriously arguing that it's not a separate body? Just because it is IN your body, it is still it's own body, functioning separately from yours.
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  #16  
April 25th, 2007, 11:53 AM
mrobinson
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Below is a partial list of the physical effects and risks of pregnancy. This list does not include the many non-physical effects and risks a woman faces in reproducing, such as the economic investment of work interruptions from pregnancy and breastfeeding, or time lost from career and other opportunity costs involved in pregnancy and later child rearing (mothers comprise 90+% of primary parents), or the emotional trauma of problem pregnancies, or the numerous economic and lifestyle repercussions that pregnancy and motherhood will have on the remainder of a mother's life.

This page was written in response to the popular, but mother-denigrating and nonsensical notion that, absent a substantial investment of some other sort, i.e. absent committed emotional and financial support of the mother of his child through pregnancy and beyond, and a familial relationship with both of them in fact, a "father" is, without anything more, a father, let alone an "equal parent."

We have been culturally conditioned to accept some incredible and false ideas. But it is ridiculous to assert that pregnancy impacts men in any way equivalent to its impact on women;that fathers and mothers have comparable experiences or feelings in connection with pregnancy or their babies; that nonresident unwed fathers, based on DNA, ipso facto "should" have "rights;" that, from the standpoint of family laws or women's choices regarding abortion, pregnancy should be viewed as nothing more than an "inconvenience"; or that the riskiest "jobs" in this world all are performed by men. (Compare the percentages of women carrying the scars of pregnancy with the percentages of men who carry the scars of battle.)

Normal, frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy:

exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
nausea and vomiting (50% of women, first trimester)
heartburn and indigestion
constipation
weight gain
dizziness and light-headedness
bloating, swelling, fluid retention
hemmorhoids
abdominal cramps
yeast infections
congested, bloody nose
acne and mild skin disorders
skin discoloration (chloasma, face and abdomen)
mild to severe backache and strain
increased headaches
difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
increased urination and incontinence
bleeding gums
pica
breast pain and discharge
swelling of joints, leg cramps, joint pain
difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
inability to take regular medications
shortness of breath
higher blood pressure
hair loss
tendency to anemia
curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
(pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women, and
are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
extreme pain on delivery
hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period (exacerbated if a c-section -- major surgery -- is required, sometimes taking up to a full year to fully recover)
Normal, expectable, or frequent PERMANENT side effects of pregnancy:

stretch marks (worse in younger women)
loose skin
permanent weight gain or redistribution
abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers, associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and reduced quality of life)
changes to breasts
varicose veins
scarring from episiotomy or c-section
other permanent aesthetic changes to the body (all of these are downplayed by women, because the culture values youth and beauty)
increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)

Occasional complications and side effects:

hyperemesis gravidarum
temporary and permanent injury to back
severe scarring requiring later surgery (especially after additional pregnancies)
dropped (prolapsed) uterus (especially after additional pregnancies, and other pelvic floor weaknesses -- 11% of women, including cystocele, rectocele, and enterocele)
pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of pregnancies)
eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of death)
gestational diabetes
placenta previa
anemia (which can be life-threatening)
thrombocytopenic purpura
severe cramping
embolism (blood clots)
medical disability requiring full bed rest (frequently ordered during part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of either mother or baby)
diastasis recti, also torn abdominal muscles
mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
serious infection and disease (e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis)
hormonal imbalance
ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
hemorrhage and
numerous other complications of delivery
refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions (e.g. epilepsy is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the number and frequency of seizures)
severe post-partum depression and psychosis
research now indicates a possible link between ovarian cancer and female fertility treatments, including "egg harvesting" from infertile women and donors
research also now indicates correlations between lower breast cancer survival rates and proximity in time to onset of cancer of last pregnancy
research also indicates a correlation between having six or more pregnancies and a risk of coronary and cardiovascular disease


Less common (but serious) complications:

peripartum cardiomyopathy
cardiopulmonary arrest
magnesium toxicity
severe hypoxemia/acidosis
massive embolism
increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease (like a pregnancy-induced cancer)
malignant arrhythmia
circulatory collapse
placental abruption
obstetric fistula


More permanent side effects:

future infertility
permanent disability
death.[/b]
The effects of pregnancy

I don't understand what is to debate?
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  #17  
April 25th, 2007, 12:24 PM
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Fetus or baby, you're not seriously arguing that it's not a separate body? Just because it is IN your body, it is still it's own body, functioning separately from yours.[/b]
Whatever you want to call it, it can't function without the mother's body. If the mother dies, until much later in the pregnancy than most abortions occur, it can't be removed and will certainly die. It's affected by the food we eat, the liquids we drink, the medicines we take, etc. Since it's growing in the woman's body, it's her choice.
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  #18  
April 25th, 2007, 12:35 PM
Caeden&#39;sMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE
Quote:
Fetus or baby, you're not seriously arguing that it's not a separate body? Just because it is IN your body, it is still it's own body, functioning separately from yours.[/b]
Whatever you want to call it, it can't function without the mother's body. If the mother dies, until much later in the pregnancy than most abortions occur, it can't be removed and will certainly die. It's affected by the food we eat, the liquids we drink, the medicines we take, etc. Since it's growing in the woman's body, it's her choice.
[/b][/quote]

It may be dependent on mom, but it is still a separate body! It has it's own heartbeat, it's own circulatory system, it's own blood type, it's own neurological system, it's own independent movements... etc... Again, just because a newborn is dependent on us to live, we don't say it's right to kill them. So why is a fetus okay?
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  #19  
April 25th, 2007, 12:40 PM
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Fetus or baby, you're not seriously arguing that it's not a separate body? Just because it is IN your body, it is still it's own body, functioning separately from yours.

Where did I argue that? :/ I said some call it a fetus some call it a baby.

But if you want to go there then yes of course it is a separate body but while it lives inside me it has no rights. I have the right to abort. The baby only functions because of my body.

Or in other words,what Elena said.
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  #20  
April 25th, 2007, 12:46 PM
Caeden&#39;sMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Fetus or baby, you're not seriously arguing that it's not a separate body? Just because it is IN your body, it is still it's own body, functioning separately from yours.

Where did I argue that? :/ I said some call it a fetus some call it a baby.

But if you want to go there then yes of course it is a separate body but while it lives inside me it has no rights. I have the right to abort. The baby only functions because of my body.

Or in other words,what Elena said.[/b]
Okay, but why shouldn't the baby have rights? If newborns have rights, so should fetuses... It's still human, is it not?
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