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would you abort if you were raped?


Abortion Debate

This forum is for Abortion debate only. If you are highly sensitive about this topic, read at your own discretion.

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View Poll Results: Would you abort if you were raped?
yes most definitely 91 25.49%
no absolutely not 166 46.50%
not sure 100 28.01%
Voters: 357. You may not vote on this poll

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  #161  
July 22nd, 2011, 12:13 PM
smt smt is offline
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There is an abortion-related though-experiment called The Violinist which is relative to this issue. The short version of the thought-experiment is that a famous violinist is in the hospital and you are connected to the violinist with a series of tubes. If you disconnect the tube from the violinist, she will die. The question is, are you obligated to stay attached the violinist? Are you obligated to sacrifice your own autonomy and your own freedom for the sake of another? In the case of a 12 year old getting pregnant, it is unlikely that a child will be able to properly care for another child without the parent/s (of the pregnant girl) making a rather large sacrifice. Is the parent obligated to make this sacrifice?

It is a tough question. On the one hand, I would say yes because as a parent you take on certain obligations to care for your own child's well-being. The pregnancy is basically a medical condition for which the parent has an obligation work through in a way that serves the child's best interests. On the other hand, abortion is a valid way of dealing with this specific medical issue, although it comes with its own set of risks. I don't think there is any right or wrong answer. It will all depend on the desires of the child and the desires of the parents and how any conflicting interests are resolved.
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  #162  
July 22nd, 2011, 05:41 PM
AMDG's Avatar Margaret
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smt View Post
There is an abortion-related though-experiment called The Violinist which is relative to this issue. The short version of the thought-experiment is that a famous violinist is in the hospital and you are connected to the violinist with a series of tubes. If you disconnect the tube from the violinist, she will die. The question is, are you obligated to stay attached the violinist? Are you obligated to sacrifice your own autonomy and your own freedom for the sake of another? In the case of a 12 year old getting pregnant, it is unlikely that a child will be able to properly care for another child without the parent/s (of the pregnant girl) making a rather large sacrifice. Is the parent obligated to make this sacrifice?

.
There are many things that make the two situations very different but I just want to mention one specifically and this intent. The goal of an abortion is to kill the fetus. The goal of the person hooked to the violinist would be to simply no longer be connected. An abortion "fails" if the fetus survives but if the violinist survived it would be something to celebate. Just to make my point - if we were to agree "you" have no obligation to stay connected to the violinist does that mean you have the right to stab the violinist to death?

On a side note, SMT, I am very curious as to why you only participate in abortion debates. Is it something you have an huge interest in? Is it something you struggle with as far as where "the line" should be drawn?

eta: lets say docs could safely remove the fetus and implant it in a woman willing to carry the child - would abortion still acceptable? Most would probably still say yes because the goal is more than to just no longer be hooked to the fetus but to actually kill the fetus - not the case with the violinist.
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Last edited by AMDG; July 22nd, 2011 at 05:46 PM.
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  #163  
July 23rd, 2011, 06:56 AM
smt smt is offline
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Well, the violinist won't survive, that is the point of the thought experiment. It is used to evaluate what our obligations are.

No, I do not have a right to stab the violinist to death. Nor does the violinist have a right to take my life. We are also both free individuals who do not have obligations towards each other, beyond those which we voluntarily choose. There is a clear difference between acts which unnecessarily take the life of another and those which allow us to keep our lives. Disconnecting from the violinist is essentially an act of self-defense.

On your eta: I would say that a pregnant woman is under no obligation to give her property to another woman to carry the pregnancy to term. This is assuming the fetus is not yet to the point of becoming a human being. After that point, I would say the person carrying the human being has an obligation to protect that new person.

Why do I participate in the abortion debate here? Because I enjoy doing it. I need no reason other than that. I do learn from discussing the issue with others. As you know I have been involved in a number of forums here, mostly the debate forums which are now all but dead.
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  #164  
July 23rd, 2011, 10:35 AM
AMDG's Avatar Margaret
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smt View Post
Well, the violinist won't survive, that is the point of the thought experiment. It is used to evaluate what our obligations are.

No, I do not have a right to stab the violinist to death. Nor does the violinist have a right to take my life. We are also both free individuals who do not have obligations towards each other, beyond those which we voluntarily choose. There is a clear difference between acts which unnecessarily take the life of another and those which allow us to keep our lives. Disconnecting from the violinist is essentially an act of self-defense.

On your eta: I would say that a pregnant woman is under no obligation to give her property to another woman to carry the pregnancy to term. This is assuming the fetus is not yet to the point of becoming a human being. After that point, I would say the person carrying the human being has an obligation to protect that new person.

Why do I participate in the abortion debate here? Because I enjoy doing it. I need no reason other than that. I do learn from discussing the issue with others. As you know I have been involved in a number of forums here, mostly the debate forums which are now all but dead.
By your violinist example I thought we were operating under the premise that the fetus was a person. Weren't you comparing a person's responsibility to the violinist with a mother's responsibility to the person growing in her womb? How does the comparison even work if the fetus isn't a person and just property? Surely there is no thought experiment if we are talking about being connect to a tree for example.
Do you recognize that intent plays any role in morality? That persons intention in taking an action makes a difference? If the violinist situation is equal to abortion in that it is an act of self-defense then intention plays a big role. Is a 300 lb man justified in defending himself against a violent 5 year old by smashing his head in? No, that level of physical violence is not needed to restrain the child. If his intent is simply to protect himself from injury then such violent means are not needed. In an abortion the intent is not self-defense at all but rather the destruction of the fetus. Like I said before, it is considered a failure if the fetus lives - even if no longer in the mother's womb.
Finally, I didn't mean to offend you by asking you why you only participate in the abortion debates. I was just curious.
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  #165  
July 25th, 2011, 03:24 PM
smt smt is offline
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I was using The Violinist thought-experiment as another way to look at the issue of obligations. I'm not sure I would draw any conclusions based on that one thing.
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  #166  
July 4th, 2012, 12:40 AM
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I would not.
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  #167  
April 5th, 2013, 01:37 PM
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I answered "not sure" because unless I was actually faced with this decision, I don't think it's possible for me to come up with even a theoretical decision.

I want a baby so much, though, and I would like to think I would keep the baby. I would have to talk it over with my DH, though, because even if I were raped, it would be his baby to raise, too, and his feelings would definitely factor into my decision.
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  #168  
April 7th, 2013, 12:30 AM
bella88's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I think I would have an abortion. It is mostly for selfish reasons but I don't think I could keep and raise a child that was a product of rape and not my husband's child. I couldn't do it if the child was forced upon me by someone who caused me such physical and emotional pain. A pregnancy and child on top of being raped would be more than I could endure. I admire a woman who can move past and raise and love their child to the best of their abilities after being impregnated by rape and I think they deserve lots of support but I don't think I could do it.
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  #169  
September 13th, 2013, 11:42 AM
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It's not the child's fault. I think it is incredible that the woman would be able to raise the child (I don't know if I could). But if you couldn't, there are a lot of loving people waiting in line who would.
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