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  • 1 Post By mamaginger

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  #1  
October 12th, 2012, 08:15 PM
jeweluv's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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..........accumulating ammunition for a few points made to me.


For a while, my best friend who witnessed to me, were good friends with a nice girl who happened to be Orthodox Jew. It ended up not going the distance for other reasons but in the meantime, her knowing I had some Jewish decent, spiraled into a convo between us three and our "interpretation" of the Old Testament. She didn't want to say it bc she didn't want to offend us/my bff, but basically said that all the proof/prophesises we depicted in the Old Test was our take on it and wrong translation and that the Old Test was meant for Jews to pass on, keep sacred, and understand. Any thoughts?

I know my bff's father has excplained that there have been many translators who have done so fairly and yet, this sticks in my mind.

....deviating. I have been so bombareded with being in thought/prayer/questioning that I have not cracked open my bible in a while. I have been podering things and praying about them. I think I sort of feel guilty bc with my 4 kids and a lot going on, I have not given my bible the attention is and GOD deserves. =(* At times I feel I gain so much just by praying on the things I have already read.
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  #2  
October 13th, 2012, 11:30 AM
mamaginger's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I don't understand this sentence:

"I know my bff's father has excplained that there have been many translators who have done so fairly and yet, this sticks in my mind."
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For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #3  
October 13th, 2012, 02:11 PM
mamaginger's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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It may take me a bunch of posts to fully respond to this. I've got a few minutes so here's my first points:

You've got to do something with Jesus. The whole world has to do SOMETHING with him.

He existed on this planet and claimed to be the Son of God. He said he was the Bread of Life and that he was One with the Father. He performed miracles. He was executed by the Jews/Romans for his "blasphemy" as they saw it.

Some view him as a good teacher and prophet but not the Son of God. Some view him as a false prophet and say he was just a "magician" and that's why he performed some "miracles." There were many magicians of that time. The religious jews of that time said he was crazy and even that he had power from the devil to do things. Then there were some who just "knew" he was the Christ. They knew he was the Messiah spoken of in the Old Testament.

The same is still true today. Everyone has to make a decision about him. He was either a total liar and false prophet, a complete raving lunatic who thought he was one with God or he was really Jesus Christ the Son of God, Our Messiah. Only ONE of those is true. Everyone has to decide what they believe. Of course everyone believes THEY are "right" but only one can be right.

Yes, everyone interprets certain parts of the Bible differently but only ONE of those interpretations is actually correct. There aren't multiple correct interpretations. Everyone has to read the Word, pray and believe that they are understanding it the correct way. There are a zillion FALSE interpretations and only ONE correct interpretation. That's just the way it is. Truth is truth and there is no other truth.

I believe Jesus existed in the beginning with God because that's what the Gospel of John teaches. I believe the OT speaks and foretells of him. I believe he fulfilled the OT prophesies and all of those things the Jews did were a SHADOW of what was to come...Jesus. The first Passover....killing the lamb and the lambs blood saving them from death. They killed a literal lamb. Jesus was called "The Lamb of God." His blood is what saves us. The jews performed many other blood sacrifices to atone for their sins. They had to do this because the final sacrificial lamb had not come yet...but now he has.


more coming....
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #4  
October 13th, 2012, 02:25 PM
mamaginger's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Isaiah 53 (written 800 years before Jesus) says:

He is despised and rejected by men...surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows...but he was WOUNDED for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities; the chastisement for our peace was upon HIM and BY HIS STRIPES WE ARE HEALED. (We all know Jesus was beaten, bruised and whipped with many stripes across his back.) He was oppressed and he was afflicted, yet he OPENED NOT his mouth; he was led as a LAMB to the slaughter and as a sheep before its shearers is silent, so he opened not his mouth...(At Jesus' arrest, Mark 15: 3 says "And the chief priests accused him of many things: but he answered NOTHING.")he was cut off from the land of the living; for the transgression of my people he was stricken. And they made his grave with the wicked (hung him between two criminals) but with the RICH at his death (they buried him in a tomb borrowed from a rich man, Joseph of Arimethia).

So tell me how that's NOT Jesus.

more later.....
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #5  
October 13th, 2012, 06:53 PM
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Wow....I agree! Sorry to confuse you....I think what I meant was that according to the girl that was Orthodox, unless you happened to be Jewish, you couldn't understand the word bc it wasn't meant for us....therefore, even when we translate it, we will never understand it. I don't agree and my best friend's dad, the pastor, has explained that many have sat down , Jewish, Christian etc and translated the bible the same ( The OT )
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  #6  
October 13th, 2012, 08:39 PM
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Its funny that a Jew would say only Jews can understand the O.T.

2 Corinthians 3 talks about when Moses came down from the mountain after God spoke to him and it says that he had to wear a veil on his face because it shone with the glory of God. It says the "children of Israel" (the Jews) couldn't look at his face. Then verse 14 says:

"But their minds were BLINDED: for until this day remains the same veil untaken away in the reading of the OLD TESTAMENT; which veil is done away in Christ. But EVEN TO THIS DAY, when Moses is read, the veil is upon THEIR HEART. Nevertheless when it (Israel) shall turn to the Lord, the veil shall be taken away."

In John 5, the Jews are having a fit because Jesus healed a man on the Sabbath. Jesus tells them that His Father works on the Sabbath so he works too. He goes through a whole long monologue about the Jews not accepting him. He says that they won't accept him based on his miracles/works and they won't believe his words when he says he is the Son of God. Then he tells them they won't even believe their own man, Moses. Verse 46 says "For had you believed Moses, you would have believe me, for HE WROTE OF ME. But if you believe not his writings, how shall you believe my words?"

Earlier in the same chapter he tells the Jews "another will come" claiming to be from God and HIM they will accept. This is referring to the future Antichrist to come.

1 John 2:22 tells us that you can't have God without Jesus: "Who is a liar but he that denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist (not the actual person but the spirit of antichrist) , that denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son, the same HAS NOT the Father..."
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #7  
October 14th, 2012, 01:19 PM
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Ok, I'm stuck on the Jewish verses at the moment...I know your question was about how we know we're right but I just want you to know what the Bible says about the Jews since this is such a big part of your life. Also, it's just important for all of us to understand the history and future of the Jews AND us (the Gentiles).

Romans 10: 12 says "For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all...For 'everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

Then on into Chapter 11 it says "I ask, then, has God rejected his people? By no means! For I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin. God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew. verse 11: So I ask, did they (the jews) stumble in order that they might fall? By no means! Rather through their trespass salvation has COME to the GENTILES....now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion mean! verse 23 "And even they, IF they do not CONTINUE in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in AGAIN."

verse 25 "I want you to understand this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the FULLNESS of the Gentiles has come in. And in this way all Israel WILL BE SAVED...for just as you were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy BECAUSE of their disobedience, so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now receive mercy."

So I know all of that may not be VERY easy to understand but Paul is teaching the Gentile Romans that God's chosen people turned away from him but that it opened the door for the Gentiles to become God's people too. Now instead of only the Jews being God's people, now the whole world can become his people. It's actually a blessing on the rest of the world that the chosen people rejected him.

And before Jesus' second coming, there will be a great revival of the Jews. Many will turn to Jesus. Zechariah 12 & 13 talk about the return of Jesus and verse 10 says "And I will pour out on the house of David (jews) and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they LOOK on me, on him whom THEY HAVE PIERCED, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn." <-------So this is showing how the Jews will see Jesus at his return and see his nail pierced hands and they will mourn because they have rejected him for so long. They will believe and turn to him then. This is also another OLD testament verse that alludes to Jesus before he has even been born.

The very first verse of chapter 13 says "On that day there shall be a fountain opened for the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem, to cleanse them from sin and uncleanness."

I say those verses to give you hope for your Jewish relatives. I know there have been many who have said Jesus would return in their lifetime. I believe its possible he could come in our life time. Many prophesies have been fulfilled. There are still some concerning the Antichrist and Tribulation time that have not happened. Watch the news. As soon as we see a leader rise out of Syria and sign a 7 year covenant of peace with Israel, we will know that he is the Antichrist and the 7 years of tribulation will begin. Jesus returns at the end of those 7 years. Many jews will be saved during the tribulation and at the 2nd coming.
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #8  
October 14th, 2012, 05:42 PM
jeweluv's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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WOW! Amazing and yet the bible says that no man shall know the end right? It's so hypocritcal bc my dh's fam who is Jewish, don't believe in the faith. So, they more or less follow the customs and as dh says "are part of the club"...they don't actually believe in Judiasm. Strange. Lee (DH) is an athiest. His dad is as well and his mom believes in spirits and energy and yet they are Jews and are very strict about hanging out w people who are Jews. (though they would never admit it)

As perfect as the new world will be when Christ comes back, I still worry about it because I like being a mother and in the new world, we will all be Christ's people but I won't be a mom anymore.

I like to take care of my children and nurture them, love them, cuddle them, etc. and in Heaven this won't be necessary right?
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  #9  
October 14th, 2012, 08:28 PM
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The Bible says "no one knows the hour or the day" but in Matthew Jesus says we WILL know the "season.". It talks about all the signs and he says "when you see these things, LOOK UP, for you know I am near...even at the door." So for Christians who KNOW the Bible, we will be watching for the signs and I believe we'll know the general time (season) he will come and will literally be watching the sky and listening for trumpets.

I think when we are in heaven or the new earth we will have a much greater love than we've ever known here. Whatever seems "good" to us here ( our love for our children) will pale in comparison to there. Ill have to ask Jonathan about this sometime. The Bible isn't very descriptive about what relationships will be like in heaven. All I can go on is God makes it clear that fellowship, family and love are important here on earth and it's fulfilling and wonderful to us even in our fallen state so I have to believe the same will be important in heaven but completely untainted by sin.
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #10  
October 14th, 2012, 08:40 PM
jeweluv's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Before the 7 yrs of tribulation there will be the rapture right in which before it gets even worse down here GODS children who r saved will be taken up? I'd love to
Know more about relationships with our loved ones here when we r then in heaven. As terrible as this world is I like a lot of things. I enjoy and love people, being a mom, and many other earthly things. I know heaven will be perfect but when I see my children and I get to be a mom to them I can't imagine anything better.
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  #11  
October 15th, 2012, 08:27 AM
mamaginger's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Welllll...thats debatable. most churches teach that the rapture happens before the tribulation but there's really no evidence in the Bible to support this. I know people don't want to be here and they use verses that say thing like God will provide a way of escape. However, "escaping" doesn't necessarily mean we are raptured out of the earth. Noahs family escaped the flood by boat. The Israelites escaped the death of the firstborn by painting the doorposts. I have lots of verses I can give you about the rapture/2nd coming when I get home from the dr. You can read them and decide for yourself. just remember not to just hear what Christians or even pastors SAY. Ask them what the Bible says. Ask for the actual verses to prove whatever point they are making. We just had a whole long bible study on pre-trib rapture. Our denomination teaches it as a whole but Jonathan (my ss teacher and one of our pastors) believes this teaching/belief is incorrect. He has presented us with all of the scripture on both sides and there really is none for a rapture before tribulation. Some people had a fit over it but no one could come up with a single convincing argument or bible verse to support their views. The problem is that many christians never read the Bible. They just listen to what other people say or even to popular Christian fiction, such as Tim Lahaye's series about the rapture/end times. What matters is Gods Word.
__________________
~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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  #12  
October 15th, 2012, 09:39 PM
mamaginger's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Ok...I still gotta come back and do the tribulation stuff......
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~ Ginger



For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb...I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made...My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place, when I was woven together...Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be. Psalm 139: 13-16

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