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So I have a friend who works in an accountant's office, and he has story after story about a husband and wife financially ruined by the other after divorce or death. That and a message from a friend has got me thinking.
In a situation where you're tying your entire financial life to another's (We all know those people ruined by divorce), is it simply a wise move to sign a pre-nuptial agreement, and doesn't necessarily reflect on how you feel about your partner? Is it a simple move that keeps people honest? Or does it reflect a flawed relationship with lack of trust? Does your answer change depending on the income level/assets of the individual in question?
I'm leaning toward marriage being the ultimate bond of trust. Therefore there has to be some risk involved, or trust is meaningless. If a pre-nuptial agreement removes an aspect of risk from the arrangement, it follows that the concept of trust is diluted, now that there's less risk.
What do you think?
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"I love mankind, it's people I can't stand."
I'm not entirely sure. There's a line between preparing for divorce and expecting it, and I'm not entirely sure where that line is. If I was intending to marry someone who had financial assets to protect, I would probably sign a pre-nup at their request. I don't think it would necessarily mean that he doesn't trust me. I think it would mean that he trusts the me that I am now, but doesn't know if he'll trust the me that I am 20 years from now. People change over time, and not always for the better.
Nope we never considered it. All of our finances/bank accounts are shared anyway. Everything is in both of our names, so it's both of ours. Once we decided to get married, we trusted in eachother enough to share everything.
If there is wealth that has been handed down or that is in a trust fund then I would protect it regardless of the relationship. If someone I marry is just rich and wants to leave me without a dime then I would question that commitment.
Most pre-nups have clauses for the amount of money you get depending on children, how long you were married, and the reason for the split. I know I wouldn't want to share my money with someone that cheated on me or broke our marriage vows.
I see nothing wrong with it so long as both parties are in agreement with the terms. A prenup would not only protect the wealthier party involved but also the spouse. No one goes into a marriage expecting to divorce, and more often then not, when it happens even the most even keeled person can get caught up in a revenge type mentality, ie I'm going to take him/her for all they are worth; or forget him/her they can go live in a card board box.
In the case of family money, a divorce may not only affect the people within the marriage, but could affect properties and business's that are owned by multiple people.
DH's family wanted for me to sign one prior to getting married, as he had some inheritance from his grandparents and his other set have plans to leave him some property. I would have been fine signing something but DH didn't feel it was important to him.
I love reading the prenuptial's we draft, some of the things in there hysterical. But to answer your questions.
In a situation where you're tying your entire financial life to another's (We all know those people ruined by divorce), is it simply a wise move to sign a pre-nuptial agreement, and doesn't necessarily reflect on how you feel about your partner? It can be a very wise move and it doesn't reflect how you feel about your partner at all. In actuality it could be insight on how one's past has been.
Is it a simple move that keeps people honest? Or does it reflect a flawed relationship with lack of trust? No I don't think it's simple by any means and it doesn't always keep people honest. I think it could reflect a past flawed relationship, not the current one. It might also reflect just a flawed person's lack of trust in people.
Does your answer change depending on the income level/assets of the individual in question? Slightly, I feel that people who are already wealthy need to protect their assets. Those who aren't there yet but may soon be may also need to protect their assets. Those who will never be wealthy don't really need one, IMO.
I used to believe that a prenuptial was just an agreement between two people who knew their marriage was doomed from the start. Now that I know more about it, not so much. It can be a very valuable and much needed document.
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I'm of the opinion that more people should be signing pre-nups. Too many things can happen that lead to the demise of the marriage. There's nothing wrong with protecting your own *** in the event things turn sour. We're not mind readers and psychics so I roll my eyes when people say, "Oh well that will never happen to me! My husband loves me and he'd never cheat or do something that would end our marriage!" Sorry, you don't know that. May as well protect what you can because things can get ugly REAL fast. You can trust someone until you're blue in the face but that doesn't mean they won't ever change. People change all the time.
I would have signed one had I been asked, or had we discussed it. Having been through a LOT of poopy breakups where I assumed it was a forever relationship, I know not to trust life. Sometimes poop happens. Contingency plans are good.
I am one of "those" people that say that. I can say that we will never get a divorce. I know we will never cheat on eachother, and any other reason (whether financial hardship, agruments..etc) we would be able to work through. We are that committed to eachother, that we can fully trust eachother. So you can roll your eyes, you aren't the first, people always find it hard to believe. But we know eachother best.
So that is why we never considered a pre nup was needed.
I am one of "those" people that say that. I can say that we will never get a divorce. I know we will never cheat on eachother, and any other reason (whether financial hardship, agruments..etc) we would be able to work through. We are that committed to eachother, that we can fully trust eachother. So you can roll your eyes, you aren't the first, people always find it hard to believe. But we know eachother best.
So that is why we never considered a pre nup was needed.
That's my point though. You don't know any of that. You have faith that it won't, and that's all fine and dandy, but faith doesn't ensure that if something happens that cannot be reconciled that you could lose everything. I don't understand why people seem to think their spouse is incapable of doing something that could end a marriage. They're not perfect, they're people too that are capable of making huge mistakes.
I love my husband, and I trust him. I don't think he would do anything that bad that it'd end our marriage, but I'm open to the fact that it could. He could change 10 years from now. Something could happen where he's not the same person I married and fell in love with. Happens all the time. I'd like to know that I'm protected should that day ever happen.
To me it is like insurance on a marriage. With a car you kind of expect something to happen at some point. If you expect this with a marriage, you have no business getting married. Besides, DH and I were poor and just graduated college when we got married. If he asked for a prenup I would have laughed.
To me it is like insurance on a marriage. With a car you kind of expect something to happen at some point. If you expect this with a marriage, you have no business getting married. Besides, DH and I were poor and just graduated college when we got married. If he asked for a prenup I would have laughed.
To me, it's not about expecting something to happen, because like you said, "if you expect this with a marriage, you have no business getting married." I think it's about realizing that life happens, things happen, things that you can't say for certain will/won't happen. I really doubt that the majority of divorced couple went into marriage thinking they'd get divorced. I doubt they went into marriage thinking that their marriage would crumble. But sometimes it does. What's wrong with protecting yourself? If you don't have a pre-nup does it mean you love and trust your husband more than I do? I don't think so. I think it means that I'm well aware that things could happen and I'm not about to risk everything I personally have.
I get where you are coming from. But I also wonder why people always go into a relationship and think of what "could" happen. So basically, you are going into the marriage, saying "My husband will probably cheat on me at some point, so I need to cover myself".
Why do people think that at some point their husband "may" cheat on them. Not every man is going to cheat in their life. There are many who don't, and I know my husband is one of them.
We all have self control, and we trust eachother when we say that we won't cheat on eachother. And with anything else, like agruments, money problems..etc, we will work through.
I get where you are coming from. But I also wonder why people always go into a relationship and think of what "could" happen. So basically, you are going into the marriage, saying "My husband will probably cheat on me at some point, so I need to cover myself".
Why do people think that at some point their husband "may" cheat on them. Not every man is going to cheat in their life. There are many who don't, and I know my husband is one of them.
We all have self control, and we trust eachother when we say that we won't cheat on eachother. And with anything else, like agruments, money problems..etc, we will work through.
"could" and "probably" are different. "Could" he cheat on me? Yeah, he could. Will he "probably" cheat on me? No, I don't think that. Right now, we're good. Things are going really smoothly and life is grand. However, 10 years is a long time. He could change. He could cheat in 10-15 years. I don't think he will, but I'm not going to say I know for a fact that if won't. I have faith, like you, that it won't happen. But like I said before, people change all the time. DH isn't an exception to that. He could very well change in 10-15 years into someone that is completely different from the person I married. If that does happen, god forbid, I'd like to know that my money and material items are safeguarded.
I know there are men that don't cheat. I hope your DH is one of them! I also hope you never get divorced and lose everything. I hope that your DH is one of those rare good guys. I want to say that my DH won't ever do anything. But I really don't like living in absolutes. Anything can happen, and I guess I like to make sure that should something happen, I'll be taken care of.
I am one of "those" people that say that. I can say that we will never get a divorce. I know we will never cheat on eachother, and any other reason (whether financial hardship, agruments..etc) we would be able to work through. We are that committed to eachother, that we can fully trust eachother. So you can roll your eyes, you aren't the first, people always find it hard to believe. But we know eachother best.
So that is why we never considered a pre nup was needed.
This exactly. Some people find it so hard to believe "true love" exists(garnered from personal experience, not from anything anyone has said here). I know DH and he knows me. We are a perfect match for one another. He's been through enough crap in his life and I've found something solid to base my life around, him and my family. Both of us know what it's like to be cheated on, and there is no way we would inflict that pain on each other. Why go out for cheeseburgers when you have filet mignon at home? We never even considered a pre-nup because A) we both had nothing when we married, B) we believe any problem we encounter can be worked out between us and C) we made a commitment, and BOTH of us are dedicating our lives to honor that commitment.
Per the debate, if someone feels a need for a pre-nup then have it. You don't have to have trust issues to ask for a pre-nup, and I completely understand the basis for getting one. If you (general) require that before marriage then more power to you in all seriousness.
**edited for clarification
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Last edited by Linzie; September 16th, 2010 at 06:09 PM.
I also feel that my DH is one of those wonderfully perfect people who would never step out, cheat, betray me, steal all of my cash, decide he's bisexual and have a relationship on the side, hire hookers, etc. (simultaneously or otherwise). Advice columns are full of letters from people that this could and would -never- happen to. I applaud confidence in this matter, but I have also seen a lot of confidence that has been overturned when poop happened.
"Plus, it lets you know just how much your intended husband thinks you're worth.." says my DH
I tried a "Dear Prudence" search to give some linking love, but honestly, the column is full of relationship quandaries and I couldn't isolate just one.
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Last edited by Jintana; September 16th, 2010 at 07:13 PM.
Reason: misquote!
My Mom will be giving my sister and I a large amount of money when she gets her settlement. I have valuable family belongings left to me by my grandparents. For those 2 reasons, I will be requiring a prenup. Doesn't mean I don't trust Tony, but if **** hits the fan I have too much family assets to risk for a divorce that may very well be his fault.
I don't see anything wrong with them, sometimes it's best to be prepared and hope you never have to go that route.
We didn't sign one and all of our finances were in both our names by the time we got married. I'm not going to say we'll never get divorced. If we do I don't really care about much that we have. I'll have the kids so I'd get a lot of the things for them anyways. I have my own business and I will continue to make money that way, DH has his job, so he'll have money that way too. We'd just take a savings account if we split. We have 2 and they both have the same amount in them, and then split the checking, and I take the SUV since I have the kids and I'd probably buy new furniture anyways.
