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Man shoots dog on leash held by a child-no charge.


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  #1  
October 13th, 2010, 05:02 AM
TheMrs's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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A nine year old was walking his dog (a young Pitbull) on a leash when he met a man and the man's dog in an ally way. The man shot the dog, saying it charged at him. Nothing has been done and police say the man could be charged with unlawful use of a weapon, but they don't mention any other charges or reason the man could be arrested. What should happen?

Nine year old boy devastated after dog shooting : News : ConnectMidMissouri.com
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Last edited by TheMrs; October 13th, 2010 at 05:06 AM.
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  #2  
October 13th, 2010, 08:30 AM
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Well it seems like there's something missing from the story. They say the dog was off the leash but did the dog charge and the boy had to let go of the leash or was the leash still in his hand when the dog was shot?

Either what the man did was awful. Unless the dog was attacking him there's no reason for what he did. Shooting a dog is awful but shooting a dog in front of the child the dog belongs to is really awful.
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  #3  
October 13th, 2010, 08:43 AM
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Unless the dog was mauling him and his life was in danger, I have no idea why he would shoot the dog. Being 'scared' isn't reason enough to kill a pet in front of a child, that's just horrible.
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  #4  
October 13th, 2010, 09:06 AM
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Chiming in- close to home for me. This isn't the greatest neighborhood- but my question is why was the man carrying a gun in the first place?
And to shoot a dog in front of a child is just horrible. Unfortunately I have little faith in Jeff City police to do anything about it.
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  #5  
October 13th, 2010, 09:10 AM
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I'm thinking he had a history with that dog. If this story is true and the dog was leashed and under control and he said "I'm going to kill him now" then it sounds like there has been contention with the dog before. Even if that contention was not liking the breed of the dog.
There is no excuse for killing the dog at all unless it is physically hurting him at that time. If it bit him in the past then he should have gone the proper route of reporting it. Shooting the dog in front of the boy seems cruel. Legally I would think shooting him while the boy held onto his leash would be child endangerment.
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  #6  
October 13th, 2010, 10:41 AM
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This is horrible, awful and scary. if it were MY child i would be fighting tooth and nail for charges, and sueing him. i hope, at the very least that he has his gun rights suspended.
i would be curious to read more of a play by play. it does seem like there's something missing.
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  #7  
October 13th, 2010, 11:07 AM
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My first point would be that if the dog charged the man and he feared for his safety, why should he wait until the dog starts mauling him before doing anything about it? I'm not going to wait for a dog to attack me, I'm going to prevent the attack.

That said, I don't think this man feared the dog for real. I get the impression he either didn't like the dog or didn't like the family and just said it charged him so he'd have an excuse to shoot it. Sick.
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  #8  
October 13th, 2010, 11:30 AM
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I think this will be a tough case, because it is all he said, she said. The boy says one thing happens, while the man who shot the dog says something completely different.

If the dog was, in fact, charging him, I would think he would be justified in protecting himself from an attack. Even if the dog was on a leash in the boys hand, the boy is only 9 years old and pit bulls are STRONG dogs. If this dog was just excitedly walking up to sniff the man's dog, he isn't justified, but nobody will ever REALLY know.

I think it will all come down to whether he had a license to carry a concealed weapon. Other than wrongful use of a weapon charges, I don't really see what they could charge him with.
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  #9  
October 13th, 2010, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxfire_ga79 View Post
My first point would be that if the dog charged the man and he feared for his safety, why should he wait until the dog starts mauling him before doing anything about it? I'm not going to wait for a dog to attack me, I'm going to prevent the attack.

That said, I don't think this man feared the dog for real. I get the impression he either didn't like the dog or didn't like the family and just said it charged him so he'd have an excuse to shoot it. Sick.
If I see a dog running towards me, why would I shoot it? It's not attacking me. If I start getting attacked, yes, I'd take the necessary precautions in order to protect myself. I wouldn't prevent an attack by shooting a charging dog. For all I know, this dog could just be really excited, not charging or attacking at all. So that's why I'd wait until the dog actually DID something before taking action.
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  #10  
October 13th, 2010, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Chloe'sMommy View Post
If I see a dog running towards me, why would I shoot it? It's not attacking me. If I start getting attacked, yes, I'd take the necessary precautions in order to protect myself. I wouldn't prevent an attack by shooting a charging dog. For all I know, this dog could just be really excited, not charging or attacking at all. So that's why I'd wait until the dog actually DID something before taking action.
What if the dog is running towards you while growling and showing it's teeth? Would you still give it the chance to get to attack you before protecting yourself?
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  #11  
October 13th, 2010, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Babybear4 View Post
What if the dog is running towards you while growling and showing it's teeth? Would you still give it the chance to get to attack you before protecting yourself?
I wouldn't shoot the dog. If I had a knife (don't know why I'd have a knife...) I wouldn't stab the dog either. I'd probably scream and run back in my house, lol. Unless I'm being physically attacked though, I wouldn't shoot, stab, tase, whatever the dog.
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  #13  
October 13th, 2010, 01:34 PM
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[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mommiex2 View Post
^ This.

While I am no longer a dog owner, I used to be. Dogs charge at things/people sometimes when they get excited and are curious. My dog wanted to lick everyone and would try and charge sometimes in order to lick people. This is the nature of some dogs, and it can't be helped. I can't even imagine what I would have done if someone shot my dog while on her leash, let alone have that happen to a 9 year old. Ridiculous.
Well, since charge means to attack by rushing violently against, I am pretty sure your dog didn't charge at people to lick them.


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Usually first instincts to protect one's self is to use your arms/legs to swing at or kick the dog. Not pull out a gun. The fight or flight response does not usually mean pull out a gun and shoot it. I believe this guy wanted to shoot the dog and didn't even wait for an excuse, he is using "the dog charged at me" as a cover-up.
If I had a gun and a dog was charging me, as this man claims the dog was, my first instinct would be to do whatever I had to at the time to protect myself. If that was to flail my arms and legs at the dog, so be it but if I had a gun and my instinct was to reach for it, I would have done that as well.

You can speculate that the man is only claiming the dog charged him all you want, but the fact of the matter is, nobody but he and the boy know and it is one persons word against the other. For all we know, the mother and boy had a vendetta against the man and are lying about what really happened in order to get the man in more trouble.
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  #14  
October 13th, 2010, 01:59 PM
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That poor boy, having to witness his dog being killed in front of him like that. I too want to know why this man was walking around with a gun while walking his dog? I hope that they can file charges against him other than just possession of a gun. What if he missed and hit the boy instead? He clearly endangered the welfare of a minor and needs to be brought up on charges for it.

Also, why couldn't have he just shoot to injure instead of kill? He could have easily just shot the dog in the leg or something. Not saying that he was justified in shooting, just that it didn't have to be a fatal shot. I would have to agree with thinking this guy had history with the dog.
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  #15  
October 13th, 2010, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by K.A.T View Post
Also, why couldn't have he just shoot to injure instead of kill? He could have easily just shot the dog in the leg or something. Not saying that he was justified in shooting, just that it didn't have to be a fatal shot. I would have to agree with thinking this guy had history with the dog.
People think gun owners have all kinds of Rambo John McClaine sharpshooter crazy action skills it's almost impossible to acquire in real life. The reality of shooting is that the last thing you ever want to do is shoot and miss. That can make the situation worse. In the heat of the moment, with someone or something charging at you and seconds to act, you don't have much of a chance to hit a leg or whatever. You need to aim for the largest part of the moving target, which is the torso. Unfortunately, that's where most animals carry their most important organs.

"Shooting to wound" is a myth created by movies. Right up there with "ow! You shot me in the leg with a .44 caliber but magically managed not to shatter any bones! Actually, it tickled! I shall run around with only a slight limp as evidence of my wound now!"
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  #17  
October 13th, 2010, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Mommiex2 View Post
There are a ton of definitions for the word "charge":



charge - definition of charge by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

Any of the bolded could have applied here, as well as to my dog. It does not specify that the term "charge" always indicates violence. My dog would suddenly rush someone in order to try and lick them. To some, she was charging at them. According to some of the many defiinitions of the word, it applies.
Got it. Generally, when I hear the word charge, I associate it with a violent attack.


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So you would normally go for a walk with your dog with a loaded weapon? Just curious.
Mmmm... Nope. But, IF I did, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to use it to protect myself from a dog that was ready to attack me. I am unsure what that has to do with anything, though?

Quote:
Really? You think that the dog didn't get shot and the child and his mother are making this whole thing up? Um, ok... do you have any sources that indicate that this is a false story? Becaue it is assumed for the purposes of this debate that this is a true story, unless you have proof otherwise.
Yep, that's what I said. There is no disputing the fact that this dog got shot and killed, but MAYBE it got killed because the man was protecting himself. Maybe the dog did actually charge him violently, and maybe the family is lying about it to try to get this man into more trouble. I don't know. Just like you don't know that this dog didn't actually try to attack this man. I never indicated that I don't think the story is true. In fact, I never indicated anything in specific. You assumed this man made up that the dog charged him just so he could shoot the dog, so I pointed out that for all you or I know, the family fabricated some of the story to get the man in more trouble.

Quote:
This is true. However, why would anyone shoot an animal that wasn't attacking them? An animal charging someone is not the same as the animal actually attacking them. I could rush forward on anyone and as long as I don't touch them, I can't be charged with assault. This guy is claiming self defense when he wasn't touched to begin with. Smells like BS to me.
So what is a person supposed to do? Wait until the dog rips his arm off, or tears into his face to protect himself?
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Last edited by Babybear4; October 13th, 2010 at 03:06 PM.
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  #19  
October 13th, 2010, 04:05 PM
TheMrs's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Originally Posted by *SamF* View Post
Chiming in- close to home for me. This isn't the greatest neighborhood- but my question is why was the man carrying a gun in the first place?
And to shoot a dog in front of a child is just horrible. Unfortunately I have little faith in Jeff City police to do anything about it.
Same here. Where are you from?
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  #20  
October 13th, 2010, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Mommiex2 View Post
Whether or not this man walked his dog every day with a loaded gun is a factor as to whether this was a premeditated act on his part or whether he truly was attacked. If he never ever walks his dog with a gun and went out with it on that night, knowing he would meet up with that boy and his pitbull, then one can easily surmise that he purposely went out to shoot the boy's dog.

It really has a lot to do with it.
How does whether or not I would walk my dog while I was carrying a gun have anything to do with it? You didn't ask me if I think this man always carries his gun with him, you asked me if I would take my dog for a walk with a gun. So, it really has NOTHING do it with it.

Quote:
I asked if that's what you thought based on what you posted. You are talking in circles. Do you think the story is true or do you think that the boy and his mom made it up like you are now asserting? I can't debate your position if you don't pick a side.
How am I asserting that the boy and his mom made it up? Re-read what I wrote. I said that it could just as easily be assumed that the mom and the boy are fabricating PARTS of the story as it could be assumed that this man is fabricating that the dog charged him. I am not sure why you don't get that? I haven't once stated that I believe the story is untrue.

Quote:
Do you automatically attack someone or something that approaches you in what you feel is a threatening manner? If you do, then you are certain that a counter attack will take place. However, if you wait, perhaps you won't be attacked at all.
If somebody is approaching me in a threatening manner, I will defend myself against the threat. I am not going to sit and wait and hope that I don't get attacked, because if my hope is wrong, I am screwed.

ETA: Here are my exact quotes. Show me where I said I believe this story is untrue. Please also show me where I have asserted that the boy and his mom made the whole thing up.

All I was saying is that if you can so easily assume that the made fabricated the story for his own sake, then it can just as easily be assumed that the family fabricated their part for their own sake. It's a two way street. If the man hated them, and they hated the man, either one of them could be lying about what really happened.

Quote:
You can speculate that the man is only claiming the dog charged him all you want, but the fact of the matter is, nobody but he and the boy know and it is one persons word against the other. For all we know, the mother and boy had a vendetta against the man and are lying about what really happened in order to get the man in more trouble.
Quote:
Yep, that's what I said. There is no disputing the fact that this dog got shot and killed, but MAYBE it got killed because the man was protecting himself. Maybe the dog did actually charge him violently, and maybe the family is lying about it to try to get this man into more trouble. I don't know. Just like you don't know that this dog didn't actually try to attack this man. I never indicated that I don't think the story is true. In fact, I never indicated anything in specific. You assumed this man made up that the dog charged him just so he could shoot the dog, so I pointed out that for all you or I know, the family fabricated some of the story to get the man in more trouble.
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Last edited by Babybear4; October 13th, 2010 at 04:15 PM.
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