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Yet Another So-Called Gender Neutral Child.


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  #1  
January 20th, 2012, 05:56 PM
foxfire_ga79
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Couple Finally Reveals Child's Gender, Five Years After Birth | Parenting - Yahoo! Shine

So basically, obviously masculine clothes are out, but obviously feminine clothes are okie dokie. Doesn't sound gender neutral to me.
Also, I always thought Sasha was a (Russian?) boy's name anyway, so that right there would have pretty much given it away to me. I've never known a girl named Sasha.
How do you think this will affect the child? How do you think piers are going to treat him?
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  #2  
January 20th, 2012, 06:04 PM
fluffycheeks's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxfire_ga79 View Post
I've never known a girl named Sasha.

President Obama has a daughter named Sasha. It's a very unisex name.
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  #3  
January 20th, 2012, 06:21 PM
foxfire_ga79
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Yea, but I don't know her.

Any comment on the actual article?
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  #4  
January 20th, 2012, 06:36 PM
fluffycheeks's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Eh, there arent enough eye rolls in the world i just think they are forcing what they want their child's identity to be on him. Like you pointed out, hotly stuff is ok but boyish stuff isn't? Doesn't make sense. And from what I could tell from the article, the kid isn't asking to wear this stuff, since the mom pointed out he doesn't have a problem with it.
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  #5  
January 20th, 2012, 06:38 PM
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I have to agree on questioning why it's okay for extremely feminine outfits but anything "hyper masculine" is out.

Also this quote:
Quote:
On a macro level she hopes her son sets an example for other parents
bothers me a little bit. It makes me question if she is allowing her son to truly chose what he likes because it is what he likes or if she steers him towards the feminine to set an example of gender neutrality. For example, it talks about her intervening on the school uniform to allow her son to wear a girls blouse with his pants.
Quote:
While the school requires different uniforms for boys and girls, Sasha wears a girl's blouse with his pants.

"I don't think I'd do it if I thought it was going to make him unhappy, but at the moment he's not really bothered either way. We haven't had any difficult scenarios yet."
She says she wouldn't do it if it made him unhappy, but it sounds to me as though it is HER choice that he wear the blouse, not his own.

To be honest, if someone could truly raise their child and allow the child to make all their own choices based on what they like and not on the parents' agenda, I think that would be great. However, I think it would be difficult to not pressure the child away from things that are typical to the gender of the child in an effort to keep him/her neutral.
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  #6  
January 21st, 2012, 01:20 AM
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I still don't see what's so wrong with "identifying a gender" and still allowing your child to make whatever choices he or she wishes to make. That's one of the parts regarding these parents and what they are doing (not just this particular set) that continues to baffle me.

I have an 8 yr old son, who sometimes wears girls clothes, has no issue playing with girls toys, tends to dance on the girly side too....all of his own accord. He's still a boy. He does boy things too, of course. I'd never "push" him towards or away, from anything. But he can make all of these choices, and more, and still identify as/with(not real sure which to use here) one gender. He knows he's a boy. I don't see anything wrong with being (and saying you are) a boy, or a girl, but still being able to make whatever life decisions you want to...regardless of whatever gender you are.

That's something I have the toughest time understanding with these people. They act as if this isn't possible. Like, the moment you say "yes, I am a boy/girl" and publicly admit it, you're automatically stuck in a stigma of only your gender related items/actions. That's not the case at all. They're actually perpetuating the very thing they're trying to pretend they are against.
Don't think I'll ever understand their reasoning, or mindset. Makes not one lick of sense.

Sorry I forgot to answer your questions.

I do think this has the potential to affect him negatively as he grows older. He'll see those pictures of himself, and hear stories of mom sharing pics(and telling people about) him wearing VERY obviously girly things and how they thought it was funny. I personally think it's perfectly fine, but yes sometimes it does look silly(my son does it a lot, just today he was wearing a mermaid costume, complete with shells over his moobies, as he calls them). He'll likely hear his mom say "we wanted to let you decide what you wanted to wear, and what you wanted to be. We didn't want to pressure you with gender bias stigmas"-or something to that effect. But then he'll see there are NEVER any pictures of him wearing anything obviously boyish. That right there, is going to cause confusion. How can you claim to live and pursue gender neutral raising when you don't actually stay neutral. If these parents don't believe this boy will realize this some day, they truly are idiots.

As for how his peers will treat him, I think as sad as it may be, he could be in for a rough ride. Not everyone understands the desire to remain neutral, and allow your children to explore. We wish they would understand, but that's not the case, and you can't make them. No amount of children doing their own thing, is going to change every opinion. It's just not going to happen. Aside from that, children can be brutally honest. The boys will wonder why this boy is wearing a girls shirt. Of course if he remains confident in his choices that will go a long way for him. But what if they aren't all his choices? What if he one day realizes this? It seems to me this is going to happen at some point, because it's abundantly clear these are NOT his choices.
When ds was in school, we had a uniform policy. On more than one occasion he'd wear his sisters' shirt to school. Normally you can't really tell the difference, with polos anyway. But the girls had some with collars that had tiny frills on the ends. He got made fun of more than once, but he always brushed it off. He was quite confident in his choice, and didn't much care what others thought. I can't say that would always be the case though. Sometimes we let what others say bug us, we're human.

I think these parents are setting their own child up for an even more difficult childhood, especially school years, simply because they lack the foresight of what it is they're really doing. I don't think they see the bigger picture. I think they have their own thoughts, feelings, opinions and such about stigmas and while I agree 100% we need to get away from them...I think they're taking the wrong approach. I bet one day they figure it out. Hopefully it will be sooner and not later.
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  #7  
January 21st, 2012, 09:07 AM
BittyBugsMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frackel View Post
I still don't see what's so wrong with "identifying a gender" and still allowing your child to make whatever choices he or she wishes to make. That's one of the parts regarding these parents and what they are doing (not just this particular set) that continues to baffle me.

I have an 8 yr old son, who sometimes wears girls clothes, has no issue playing with girls toys, tends to dance on the girly side too....all of his own accord. He's still a boy. He does boy things too, of course. I'd never "push" him towards or away, from anything. But he can make all of these choices, and more, and still identify as/with(not real sure which to use here) one gender. He knows he's a boy. I don't see anything wrong with being (and saying you are) a boy, or a girl, but still being able to make whatever life decisions you want to...regardless of whatever gender you are.

That's something I have the toughest time understanding with these people. They act as if this isn't possible. Like, the moment you say "yes, I am a boy/girl" and publicly admit it, you're automatically stuck in a stigma of only your gender related items/actions. That's not the case at all. They're actually perpetuating the very thing they're trying to pretend they are against.
Don't think I'll ever understand their reasoning, or mindset. Makes not one lick of sense.

Sorry I forgot to answer your questions.

I do think this has the potential to affect him negatively as he grows older. He'll see those pictures of himself, and hear stories of mom sharing pics(and telling people about) him wearing VERY obviously girly things and how they thought it was funny. I personally think it's perfectly fine, but yes sometimes it does look silly(my son does it a lot, just today he was wearing a mermaid costume, complete with shells over his moobies, as he calls them). He'll likely hear his mom say "we wanted to let you decide what you wanted to wear, and what you wanted to be. We didn't want to pressure you with gender bias stigmas"-or something to that effect. But then he'll see there are NEVER any pictures of him wearing anything obviously boyish. That right there, is going to cause confusion. How can you claim to live and pursue gender neutral raising when you don't actually stay neutral. If these parents don't believe this boy will realize this some day, they truly are idiots.

As for how his peers will treat him, I think as sad as it may be, he could be in for a rough ride. Not everyone understands the desire to remain neutral, and allow your children to explore. We wish they would understand, but that's not the case, and you can't make them. No amount of children doing their own thing, is going to change every opinion. It's just not going to happen. Aside from that, children can be brutally honest. The boys will wonder why this boy is wearing a girls shirt. Of course if he remains confident in his choices that will go a long way for him. But what if they aren't all his choices? What if he one day realizes this? It seems to me this is going to happen at some point, because it's abundantly clear these are NOT his choices.
When ds was in school, we had a uniform policy. On more than one occasion he'd wear his sisters' shirt to school. Normally you can't really tell the difference, with polos anyway. But the girls had some with collars that had tiny frills on the ends. He got made fun of more than once, but he always brushed it off. He was quite confident in his choice, and didn't much care what others thought. I can't say that would always be the case though. Sometimes we let what others say bug us, we're human.

I think these parents are setting their own child up for an even more difficult childhood, especially school years, simply because they lack the foresight of what it is they're really doing. I don't think they see the bigger picture. I think they have their own thoughts, feelings, opinions and such about stigmas and while I agree 100% we need to get away from them...I think they're taking the wrong approach. I bet one day they figure it out. Hopefully it will be sooner and not later.
Very well said. I think this trend to keep your kids gender neutral is really just a parent wishing they had the opposite sex. Maybe I'm wrong but everything I read seems to have the parent subtly pushing their child one way or the other and then claiming gender neutrality. I just don't like it. Just let the kids be who they are and see where they end up.
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  #8  
January 21st, 2012, 09:40 AM
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I love how they said she managed to hide it from the world. News flash: The world didn't care, and you are a fame *****. I haven't even heard of this women or her kid. The masculine thing bothered me too. If it was truly about not gender-typing, why were those things off limits?

And the girl's blouse thing at school. Yeah, she's obviously got an ulterior motive. She's making the choice for him.
She's a blogger, she wants hits, period.
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  #9  
January 21st, 2012, 09:57 AM
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I heard about this a while back and just found out that they revealed the gender. I can see this having negative implications. This kid was raised without gender until age five. Now that his gender has been revealed, I could see this kid being ashamed that he now has a gender because his parents have put gender in a negative light.

I remember reading that only the parents were allowed to change his diaper so that the gender would not be revealed. I could only imagine that any time anyone looked at that kid, they immediately wonder what was under the diaper. ew
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  #10  
January 21st, 2012, 10:18 AM
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This is another gender neutral child, this is the same one from awhile back, and now they came out saying he's a boy. Which for some reason I already assumed. Sasha is a unisex name.

I think this whole thing was silly, and these parents took it to the extreme.
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  #11  
January 23rd, 2012, 05:37 AM
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Agree with Frackel and Leslie - just a publicity *****.
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  #12  
January 23rd, 2012, 10:08 AM
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Makes me think they actually wanted a girl. How sad for the boy if he figures that out when he is older.
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  #14  
January 23rd, 2012, 04:06 PM
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I agree with Frackel, and that was very well said.

In our house, it's the opposite. DSS is discouraged from ANYTHING "girlie". no dolls, no pink, no jewelry. But if we have a girl, she'll be encouraged to play with everything masculine. It's a double standard. If DH knew that DSS pulled my wedding gear out of the closet this weekend (right down to the bouquet) and walked around the living room in it.. and I let him do it.. he'd have a right fit. But if his (theroheical) baby girl put on a top hat and bowtie, it'd be darling

needless to say, if DSS ever asks me for his own baby, I'm buying the kid a doll and all the fixings.
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  #15  
January 24th, 2012, 11:06 AM
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Ds owns dolls, some are boys and some are girls. His favorite was a girl when he got her, but then he changed her clothes and named her Toby. He does all sorts of things that come across pretty girly to a lot of people. My mom and I encourage it, as long as he enjoys whatever it is he's doing(and it's something he's allowed to do, of course). The same way we encourage the girls to do whatever they choose, even if it's more boyish.

Their father hates it. Then again he's not only sexist but an idiot, so I don't really much care what his opinion is on things like that. He's not a very encouraging person, regardless. I prefer to let the kids decide their own routes whenever possible. It is after all their life and their journey, not mine. I offer guidance when and where needed(kinda my job) but I never push, ever. Especially as far as this stuff is concerned. We've got so much more to worry about as parents, and so much more to focus our energy on. I just don't understand the mentality of some parents and why they choose to make life more difficult than it needs to be(for them, and even more importantly, their children).

This morning he and dd2 decided to cover the house with cardboard boxes they opened up and flattened, then put various things under to make what I originally thought was a road. It's not, it's a roller coaster. They're driving barbies around on it. Apparently the zhu zhu pets decided they didn't want to play right.
But he plays with girl stuff ALL the time. Just like the girls play with boy stuff ALL the time, even long before they even had a brother. One of my oldest's fav toys when she was a toddler was actually a dog toy she picked out at the pharmacy while we were out one day with my mom. It's a pink thing that squeaks(I think it's supposed to look like coiled rope, but it doesn't). I guess letting her play with that means she's a dog too, or worse will turn into one, roflmao.
(she's 13, and has yet to turn into a dog, I doubt she's going to anytime soon, but I'll keep you posted just in case)
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  #16  
January 24th, 2012, 05:54 PM
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I think it's very self serving and ignorant to treat your child like a science project. If they were so interested in gender neutral experiements they should do it on themselves. He might be their child, but imo they had no right to make him live as a big question mark like that.

Kid's going to grow up and sue his moms. Just wait. lol
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  #18  
January 25th, 2012, 04:42 PM
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I hope they were secluding him from the world, too. Surprise! Kids learn by compartmentalizing. Sasha, if not kept in a box, saw girls doing this and boys doing that. He'll make his own opinions about what girls and boys do, regardless of whether he wears a tutu.

I really don't understand this, it's like putting a cast on before you fall out of a tree. When DD says things that she misinterprets like "Legos are for boys!" when we're at Toys R Us (that's what the commercial shows us, right?), we say "No way, girls can play with Legos! Want to get some and try them out?"

At 5, 6, 7 years old specifically, kids like to classify things. That's how they see and understand the world, not how the world is "trying to fit them into a box." There are stereotypes present in the world, sure, but there are for pretty much every thing you can think of. In fact, I can't think of one occupation, race, or situation where there ISN'T a stereotype. You just steer away from it as a parent.
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