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Is Chris Brown Rehabilitated?


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  #1  
February 12th, 2012, 05:30 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Watching him on the Grammys' this weekend and seeing that he is clearly still quite popular and sells out stadiums, post-Rhianna, I'm wondering if people see him as rehabilitated. Was his incident a drug fueled out-of-touch moment of rage that is unlike his normal personality and character? Or is he just lying in wait for his next outburts and victim?

I'm wondering on a larger scale too if you think domestic violence offenders can be rehabilitated. Are you surprised Chris Brown is so popular still?
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  #2  
February 12th, 2012, 06:20 PM
Frackel's Avatar DOh!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lash View Post
I'm wondering on a larger scale too if you think domestic violence offenders can be rehabilitated. Are you surprised Chris Brown is so popular still?
Simple answers? No, and no.
He's popular both in spite of, and despite his horrid actions. It's an odd mix, really. He does something terrible, and it makes him more popular with one crowd, yet still making him unpopular with a whole different crowd. People put other people up on special pedestals for all sorts of strange reasons. I don't frankly get it, but, I guess I don't have to. I can't say I've ever liked the guy before, and until he turned into an abusive a-hole, never gave him much thought. Actually, I still don't give him much thought. I prefer not to ponder on such things.

I don't believe people that resort to violence against another human can ever be rehabilitated. I think, in their minds, their actions were/are justified and there is just no way to change that. Even if they never resort to hitting/abusing another again. They might say, eventually, they realize their actions were wrong, but I honestly do not believe most of them truly feel that way and if it came down to it, they'd likely repeat the same offense. I guess I can't say that with any amount of certainly, it's an assumption on my part, but I've had enough firsthand evidence, and see enough second hand evidence over the years to come to that conclusion. Some people, simply suck, at being human beings and using common sense. Those who resort to violence against others like that, when there are so many other options, fall into that category for me.
I have very little tolerance and understanding for someone who resorts to hitting another human being to solve their issues.(I'm not talking about self defense here, either, that's a whole different scenario, and sometimes a necessary evil). There's likely not much anyone could tell me that would change my mind. One of my character flaws I suppose.(well to some, I don't see it as a flaw)

But I do honestly worry about the folks who idolize people who behave this way. I worry about whether or not the synapses in their brains are working properly. One day, they could malfunction, and cause a fire, or something, in there.
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  #3  
February 12th, 2012, 06:30 PM
Poncho06's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Domestic abusers are rarely rehabilitated even with treatment so I don't believe he is any better today than he was during the incident. Considering he had a semi-recent outburst while on Good Morning America I highly doubt it was an isolated incident.

The public as a whole rarely seems to give a crap about the disgusting behavior people in the media exhibit, especially those against women. Mel Gibson (too many to list), Roman Polanski (child rapist), Ted Kennedy (Mary Jo Kopechne for starters) all continue(d) to have successful careers after perpetrating horrible acts toward women, minorities or both.

Does batterers' treatment work? A meta-analytic review of domestic violence treatment 10.1016/j.cpr.2002.07.001 : Clinical Psychology Review | ScienceDirect.com

Quote:
This meta-analytic review examines the findings of 22 studies evaluating treatment efficacy for domestically violent males. The outcome literature of controlled quasi-experimental and experimental studies was reviewed to test the relative impact of Duluth model, cognitive–behavioral therapy (CBT), and other types of treatment on subsequent recidivism of violence. Study design and type of treatment were tested as moderators. Treatment design tended to have a small influence on effect size. There were no differences in effect sizes in comparing Duluth model vs. CBT-type interventions. Overall, effects due to treatment were in the small range, meaning that the current interventions have a minimal impact on reducing recidivism beyond the effect of being arrested. Analogies to treatment for other populations are presented for comparison. Implications for policy decisions and future research are discussed.
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  #4  
February 12th, 2012, 06:56 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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I remember a debate about a year ago where I posted about female offenders of violence. Interestingly it was about the Rihanna/Eminem song (and yep I started that debate too now that I just searched it).

Anyways people seemed to be much harsher towards males that perpetrate violence and more lenient towards female offenders. Do you think between Chris Brown and Rihanna that it was a 2-sided violent relationship? Does that change anything for you if they were BOTH abusive? Change anything as in, they both need to be held accountable.

In fact a study I posted in that debate found that women were like 3 times more likely to commit violence in relationships than men.

Quote:
Where only one partner in a relationship is violent, it is more likely to be the woman, University of Otago researchers have found.

The researchers found that among people in violent relationships, 13.8 per cent of women said they were the sole perpetrators of violence, and only 2.4 per cent of men said they were the only violent one in the relationship.

"The problem is our society just accepts female violence - it accepts violence in general," Ms Robertson said.

The violence often went both ways, and men and women were equally likely to be on both ends of it.

Ms Robertson said she did not look at whether incidents of female violence were in self defense, but the fact that in quite a few cases women were the sole perpetrators indicated that could not be the only explanation.

And another
Quote:
Study after study shows women are not merely violent in self-defence but strike the first blow in about half of all disputes. The American social scientists Murray Straus and Richard Gelles reported from two large national surveys that husbands and wives had assaulted each other at approximately equal rates, with women engaging in minor acts of violence more frequently. Elsewhere, they found more wives than husbands were severely violent towards their spouses.

Moreover, there is now considerable evidence that women initiate severe violence more frequently than men. A survey of 1,037 young adults born between 1972 and 1973 in Dunedin, New Zealand, found that 18.6% of young women said they had perpetrated severe physical violence against their partners, compared with 5.7% of young men. Three times more women than men said they had kicked or bitten their partners, or hit them with their fists or with an object.
That thread was chock full of examples and research and evidence that apparently women are more likely to cause violence, start the violence, have deadlier types of violence.

So the question now is less about needing to merely rehabilitate Chris Brown, and more about, did we miss her side of this cycle too? Her video about love in a hopeless place is a 2nd of hers that shows her being just as abusive as him. We didn't order her to complete rehabilitation. We only ordered him to do so.

The old debate:
http://www.justmommies.com/forums/f4...y-you-lie.html (Love the way you lie)
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  #5  
February 12th, 2012, 07:45 PM
Poncho06's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I can't see how you legally could force the victim of a crime into a rehabilitation type program. Even if she was overall in the relationship the abuser, the incident that he was arrested for, she was the victim, kwim?

Perhaps removing the stigma from men reporting being the victims of these types of crimes would lead to more arrests of female perpetrators thus more court ordered rehabilitation.
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  #6  
February 12th, 2012, 07:52 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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How do you know that? How do you know she was just as violent that night? You really think the cops were going to pay attention to cuts or bruises on him from that night? We didnt' get a picture of him that night. His mugshot was never released which is really really interesting to me now that she seems to have multiple songs and video's displaying abusive relationships, and women as violent in the relationship.

I would even hazard a guess that her Love In A Hopeless Place is meant to take half the responsibility for their relationship and violence together.


Amazingly enough, it was on the way to the Grammy's when this incident happened. And now this year, he's winning a Grammy and performing on stage. He is now performing his 2nd number of the night on stage.
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  #7  
February 12th, 2012, 08:09 PM
Poncho06's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I don't know that and can only form an opinion based upon the facts out there. She very much could have been an instigator that night. It still wouldn't change the fact that he was the only person arrested and charged so by all current public accounts she is only a victim. Forcing any person who is solely identified as a victim in a criminal proceeding into any type of therapy is wrong.

Again, removing the stigmas associated with female to male violence would hopefully lead to an arrest IF both parties are equally culpable in an incident or if she was the sole aggressor. Better training for police, hospital and others who would be on the front lines on how to see signs of male victims of DV.
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  #8  
February 12th, 2012, 08:14 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Not that it means much, but searching it now turns up tons of accounts of her punching him while he was driving, punching windows in the car, throwing things in the car and a history of hitting, punching, kicking him in the balls, slapping him. Not that it means much I'm sure because it's all speculation, but it looks like she threw the first blows that night.

I really wonder what his face looked like in that mug shot.
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  #9  
February 12th, 2012, 08:42 PM
BittyBugsMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I don't think abusers can be rehabilitated - or at least, a large majority of them can't be. I am surprised he is as popular as he is but I'm also surprised she is as popular as she is.
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  #10  
February 12th, 2012, 11:01 PM
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Even if she did pick a fight, or start an argument, it's rarely ever wise (or necessary) to perpetuate the physical/verbal/whatever violence.
I don't know if she did, or did not, instigate that fight. But I do know two wrongs don't make a right. So if she put her hands on him/got violent, he should have walked away, unless his life was at stake. That's my take no matter who the offender is. I don't discriminate based on sex, personally.
If a woman gets violent with a man, it's just as bad(imo) as when a man gets violent with a woman.
I don't care for putting your hands on another person and harming them. Self defense is one thing, when your life is at stake and you cannot get away from the situation without physically defending yourself against the attacker. But more times than not, there is no need to reciprocate the violence. Doing so is only going to escalate the problem.

If a man hit me, and my only only way to get out of the situation would be to incapacitate him, before fleeing...I would. If a man hit me, and I could get away without doing so, though, that is the better option. But that's just my opinion. I was taught to never fight back, unless you have to, and to only do so long enough to give yourself a window so you can escape-not to "win the fight" as it were. The whole "s/he hit me first" doesn't sit well with me, even when it's utterly necessary, it still makes my stomach cringe.

I do think overall people tend to give women a break vs men though. I don't share that opinion, but it sure does seem to be a popular one. Then again many seem to think of women as being the weaker sex too-which is another opinion I do not share.
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  #11  
February 13th, 2012, 07:47 AM
tiredmom's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Getting a little off topic here, but did you guys see this?

25 Extremely Upsetting Reactions To Chris Brown At The Grammys

I know they were probably just joking around, with their brains overwhelmed with lust; but really???
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  #12  
February 13th, 2012, 09:49 AM
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They're both idiots and both deserve each other. She was just as much at fault as he is for all of this, and if anyone thinks SHE's innocent and didn't also abuse him, they're wrong. Both parties are wrong in this case. I do not respect either person.

And no, I think that it takes an act of God to get people who have this much anger toward someone they supposedly love to get rehabilitated...this is very rare though, most of the abusers don't just stop doing it. They just learn to hide it better.
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  #13  
February 13th, 2012, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiredmom View Post
Getting a little off topic here, but did you guys see this?

25 Extremely Upsetting Reactions To Chris Brown At The Grammys

I know they were probably just joking around, with their brains overwhelmed with lust; but really???
I was just coming to post this... All I can do is shake my head....I hope my children (and most of the ones ya'll are raising) end up not staying stupid stuff like that.
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  #14  
February 14th, 2012, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lash View Post
. Was his incident a drug fueled out-of-touch moment of rage that is unlike his normal personality and character?

Drugs and Alcohol do not make non-violent people violent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lash View Post
I remember a debate about a year ago where I posted about female offenders of violence. Interestingly it was about the Rihanna/Eminem song (and yep I started that debate too now that I just searched it).

Anyways people seemed to be much harsher towards males that perpetrate violence and more lenient towards female offenders. Do you think between Chris Brown and Rihanna that it was a 2-sided violent relationship? Does that change anything for you if they were BOTH abusive? Change anything as in, they both need to be held accountable.

In fact a study I posted in that debate found that women were like 3 times more likely to commit violence in relationships than men.




And another

That thread was chock full of examples and research and evidence that apparently women are more likely to cause violence, start the violence, have deadlier types of violence.

So the question now is less about needing to merely rehabilitate Chris Brown, and more about, did we miss her side of this cycle too? Her video about love in a hopeless place is a 2nd of hers that shows her being just as abusive as him. We didn't order her to complete rehabilitation. We only ordered him to do so.

The old debate:
http://www.justmommies.com/forums/f4...y-you-lie.html (Love the way you lie)


Usually absive relationships go both ways, but normally because the Male is the offender, and the woman will act out when she can. get her digs in when she has the oppertunity, so to say, and then it's wrong and dirty and then he goes right back. it is a nasty cycle and one that is hard to break.

Typically things start slow and small and progress. it's all very sad. Unless you've been in that situation you'll never know how/why it ends up going the way it does....
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  #15  
February 14th, 2012, 02:00 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Normally the male is the offender? Clearly you didn't read anything I posted.
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  #16  
February 14th, 2012, 02:06 PM
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I disagree that alcohol and drugs wouldn't turn an otherwise calm person into an abusive one. I've seen people act TOTALLY different under the influence of drugs and alcohol.
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  #17  
February 14th, 2012, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by *Jillian* View Post
I disagree that alcohol and drugs wouldn't turn an otherwise calm person into an abusive one. I've seen people act TOTALLY different under the influence of drugs and alcohol.
Totally agree.

I watched my family member go through a long battle of drug and alcohol abuse. He was a non-violent person unless he was under the influence. The change between being sober and being under the influence was complete night and day. He was also verbally violent/abusive when coming down from the drugs.
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  #18  
February 15th, 2012, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lash View Post

Anyways people seemed to be much harsher towards males that perpetrate violence and more lenient towards female offenders. Do you think between Chris Brown and Rihanna that it was a 2-sided violent relationship? Does that change anything for you if they were BOTH abusive? Change anything as in, they both need to be held accountable.


So the question now is less about needing to merely rehabilitate Chris Brown, and more about, did we miss her side of this cycle too? Her video about love in a hopeless place is a 2nd of hers that shows her being just as abusive as him. We didn't order her to complete rehabilitation. We only ordered him to do so.

The old debate:
http://www.justmommies.com/forums/f4...y-you-lie.html (Love the way you lie)
I don't really have an opinion on Chris Brown and Rihanna as I never looked into the details but I do find the bolded very interesting and agree that there is a double standard. Found this.
Fathers and Mothers: Teach your Children Well, Including your Sons | Shrink4Men
Quote:
Obviously, there is a glaring double standard in our society regarding violence against women and violence against men. Dr Phil believes it’s abuse when a man hits a woman and that it’s a “relationship issue” when a woman hits a man. TV networks run “funny” ads in which men are kicked in the groin repeatedly and wives are portrayed as all-knowing sages who keep their imbecile husbands in check. Women who assault their male partners because they suspect infidelity, like Tiger Woods and Elin Nordegren, are lauded as heroes and publicly supported with statements such as, “He had it coming!” and “You go, girl!” Imagine the public outcry if the genders were reversed in these scenarios.
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  #19  
February 15th, 2012, 08:03 PM
SusieQ2's Avatar Jersey Girl
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The police report from that night. He deserved jail time.

Several other stars were not supportive having Chris Brown perform at the Grammy's. Many of them posted on Twitter. This was his response.

Quote:
A defiant Brown responded to the criticism on Tuesday, tweeting, "HATE ALL U WANT BECUZ I GOT A GRAMMY Now! That's the ultimate F--- OFF!" Brown later tweeted, "IM BACK SO WATCH MY baCK as I walk away from all this negativity." Both tweets have been deleted.
Brown responds to Grammy criticism on Twitter - MSN Music News

Yeah, I'm going with not rehabilitated. He's a douche bag who likes to beat on women.
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