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Using Guns as a prop in dance


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  #1  
February 22nd, 2012, 10:19 PM
Linzie's Avatar Veteran
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So i saw on Yahoo, this show "Dance Moms" which features young girls and their mothers in competitive dance. This certain number was called "Private Eye" and had the girls using gold plastic guns as a prop.

Primetime in No Time: Recaps & Clips From Last Night's Shows | Yahoo! TV (they just have a link to Prime Time in no time, but it should pull up, if not the videos are titled "Dance Moms - Clip 1" or "Clip 2". I'll try to see if i can find a specific link.)

At first, the mothers were horrified at the idea of their daughters carrying around guns, but it showed later in the video at the competition one mom said "I wish i could have been horrified by the guns, but they were better than i thought."

I know some of you may not agree with the whole dance thing (think the girls dancing to Single Ladies a while back) but from what i saw of the routine, and the theme in general, I don't think this was all that bad. One of the girls said "I know the difference between a real gun and plastic gun, and I wouldn't touch a real gun."

Was it really that bad for the dance instructor to use a gun as a prop for the dance routine? What would you have done?

Edited to add: Is there any situation would you be ok with your child using/playing with a *toy* gun?
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Last edited by Linzie; February 22nd, 2012 at 10:31 PM.
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  #2  
February 22nd, 2012, 11:38 PM
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We have "guns" in our house. They shoot plastic tipped Nerf bullets. We've got a barrel loader, a clip sniper and an automatic one. DSS asked for them last summer, but we didn't have the money so we got them for Christmas. His dad had a talk with him about the difference between a real gun and his toy guns and he has had a few pop quizes about them since. He loves them, and we love them. I'm the favorite target, I keep a clip board next to me at all times to use as a face shield. DSS fully believes that you only shoot things you want to eat with a gun, and as he says "people are friends, not food."

We do not allow ANY play gun that resembles something DH may one day own. We feel it is easier for DSS to separate play and real when we don't give him a handgun that shoots darts. So not Handguns, no Shotguns, No Rifles (my sniper one is far enough from a real rifle that he shouldn't confuse it).. there's a few more but I'm not up to par on my gun types.

He will probably get a small "real gun" for Easter. I think they're called a cricket? He got a childrens bow for Christmas.

I do not know what I'd have done about the dancing with guns.
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Last edited by plan4fate; February 22nd, 2012 at 11:43 PM.
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  #3  
February 23rd, 2012, 08:26 AM
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I couldn't view the video so I don't know the full context. If I have time, I'll try to google an article. But on the whole, it doesn't bother me to think about a dance routine to "Private Eye" using obviously fake plastic guns for props.

And I'm fine with my kids playing with toy guns. They've had squirt guns, cap guns, plastic guns, space guns, used sticks for guns, their fingers for guns, they make guns out of legos, nerf etc..
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  #4  
February 23rd, 2012, 08:54 AM
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I dunno. I see it as the same as the ROTC kids doing their rifle routine. Do I think its necessary? No. Am I horrified at the thought of it? No.
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  #5  
February 23rd, 2012, 09:15 AM
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My son plays with toy "guns" often. But they really do look like toys. I will not purchase a real life looking toy gun, ever. Also, we usually reserve toys like that for in the home. As long as a child is taught not to play with the real thing, I see no problem with toys.
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  #6  
February 23rd, 2012, 12:21 PM
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The dance was well done. The guns were obviously props - bright gold. Even the mom's admitted afterward that they thought the dance was good and they were ok with the guns.

My kids play with fake guns all the time - even semi-realistic looking ones. I grew up playing with guns too. I haven't killed anyone (well not yet anyway )
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  #7  
February 23rd, 2012, 02:52 PM
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I don't really know how I feel about this - I couldn't see the vid.

I never played with toy guns (or at least can't remember doing it) and DD isn't in to that type of play. I would probably discourage it if she was, honestly. I'm pro-gun, we own several, but it makes me uncomfortable to think about DD pretending to shoot someone, or pretending to be shot. That said, I'd probably feel the same way about a dance involving guns - but again, couldn't say for sure. Without seeing the vid - why couldn't they hold up their hands like a gun if they were play-acting sneaking around with them or something?
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  #8  
February 23rd, 2012, 03:04 PM
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I dont have a problem with it at all.

We plan to take Nicholas to learn to shoot the .22 when he's around 5 or whenever we feel he is ready. He will have toy guns, swords, whatever.
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  #9  
February 23rd, 2012, 03:09 PM
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Okay, just found it on my laptop. No, I wouldn't be okay with that at all. The details in those guns were just way too close to real (and there are gold colored guns). I didn't see why they couldn't mime with their hands.

"She said it would blow the crowd away - I hope not for real, because that would get us disqualified." That's exactly the kind of ho-hum attitude towards talking about guns that I dislike.
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  #10  
February 23rd, 2012, 03:16 PM
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If this is the Dance Moms that I think it is, I think the lady does dumb stuff just to get a reaction out of people.
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  #11  
February 23rd, 2012, 04:26 PM
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Play guns are the least the people need to worry about with that show. Those parents are paying that women to berate her children and it's absolutely despicable. I'm not overly concerned about the use of play weapons for anyone, and if my kids want to play with them, I don't really mind. As long as they don't look like the real thing.
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  #12  
February 23rd, 2012, 09:14 PM
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WHOOO Leslie and I have been discussing this show for the last few days on Facebook!

I think I have to agree, the guns were the least concerning thing about that show.
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  #13  
February 23rd, 2012, 09:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BittyBugsMama View Post
I dunno. I see it as the same as the ROTC kids doing their rifle routine. Do I think its necessary? No. Am I horrified at the thought of it? No.
I have to say something about that statement, as a former JROTC member. We went through extensive training to even TOUCH a gun, real or fake, in JROTC. We had to learn to respect a gun and know the honor behind real guns before we even touched a fake gun that had cement in a barrel that could never shoot anything even if we tried. Drill practice guns HURT when you drop them on your foot or get clocked in the head, but they can not shoot. That is about the extent of being hurt, lol. But I do want to say that I see a huge difference between girls in dance routines and girls in a drill squad in JROTC because at least in our unit (number one in the state, huzzah!) we had extensive training for respect of the gun and even had to get to a certain point in honor in the program before we were allowed to even do drill. So I see a huge difference. Little girls dancing without knowing how to treat a gun, honor a gun, dismantle a gun and so on... I don't necessarily agree with it.

Nerf guns and such that are obviously fake are okay in my house as long as they are played for fun and aren't going "BANG YOURE DEAD!" and aren't shooting at the head. Real looking guns? Nope. NOT okay for me. Not learning how to respect a gun and making a real looking gun look cool? Absolutely not okay. Even recently we were showing my SO's son a rifle and he held it up near my head trying to figure something out and I said "Woah Wes, watch out" and I ducked. He said "There aren't any bullets in it, chill!" I said "Rule number one of guns, you ALWAYS assume it's loaded!" And his Dad agreed and took it away. We have no issues with kids learning guns, but we don't glorify them to be cool. We make them to be weapons to be respected and dancing with them to be cute isn't respectful. I do NOT think what I did with them in JROTC was in any way "cute." We respected them, we had honor behind them, and we learned the history of the US military in our actions and learned how to respect the machinery in our hands and that respect is still deeply embedded in my brain.
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  #14  
February 24th, 2012, 02:12 AM
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I was also in JROTC but they never taught us anything about our riffles..actually they did...they taught us how to spin the,toss them etc LOL..

Being a mom with two dancers (my son andmy daughter) I dont see any harm in it..its a dance and you act..plus they looked fake (gold)
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  #15  
February 24th, 2012, 06:39 AM
Tammyjh's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lesliek0211 View Post
Play guns are the least the people need to worry about with that show. Those parents are paying that women to berate her children and it's absolutely despicable. I'm not overly concerned about the use of play weapons for anyone, and if my kids want to play with them, I don't really mind. As long as they don't look like the real thing.
I agree. Dh and I watched a few episodes of the show and I feel the same way. We haven't watched it since.
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  #16  
February 24th, 2012, 08:36 AM
BittyBugsMama's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mom2Froggy View Post
I have to say something about that statement, as a former JROTC member. We went through extensive training to even TOUCH a gun, real or fake, in JROTC. We had to learn to respect a gun and know the honor behind real guns before we even touched a fake gun that had cement in a barrel that could never shoot anything even if we tried. Drill practice guns HURT when you drop them on your foot or get clocked in the head, but they can not shoot. That is about the extent of being hurt, lol. But I do want to say that I see a huge difference between girls in dance routines and girls in a drill squad in JROTC because at least in our unit (number one in the state, huzzah!) we had extensive training for respect of the gun and even had to get to a certain point in honor in the program before we were allowed to even do drill. So I see a huge difference. Little girls dancing without knowing how to treat a gun, honor a gun, dismantle a gun and so on... I don't necessarily agree with it.

Nerf guns and such that are obviously fake are okay in my house as long as they are played for fun and aren't going "BANG YOURE DEAD!" and aren't shooting at the head. Real looking guns? Nope. NOT okay for me. Not learning how to respect a gun and making a real looking gun look cool? Absolutely not okay. Even recently we were showing my SO's son a rifle and he held it up near my head trying to figure something out and I said "Woah Wes, watch out" and I ducked. He said "There aren't any bullets in it, chill!" I said "Rule number one of guns, you ALWAYS assume it's loaded!" And his Dad agreed and took it away. We have no issues with kids learning guns, but we don't glorify them to be cool. We make them to be weapons to be respected and dancing with them to be cute isn't respectful. I do NOT think what I did with them in JROTC was in any way "cute." We respected them, we had honor behind them, and we learned the history of the US military in our actions and learned how to respect the machinery in our hands and that respect is still deeply embedded in my brain.
Ok... I was just trying to think of a comparison where children are handling fake guns and ROTC was the only thing I could think of.
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  #17  
February 24th, 2012, 02:26 PM
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I am wondering how much of that show is real.
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  #18  
February 24th, 2012, 04:17 PM
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No issues with it here.

My kids know the difference between toys and real weapons, and when to handle both. I'd rather they know how to handle them-when they're ready of course-then be so terrified(or ignorant) of them that if push came to shove they wouldn't be able to use one. Not that they'll likely ever need to use a real weapon. But there's nothing wrong with having the skill set, imo. Again, assuming you've taught them well, but that sits on the parents' shoulders.
But that goes for more than just guns, as well. I learned the same skills as a child, and I can confidently say, I've never misfired, misused, abused, or "played with" a real weapon, despite owning a crap ton of toy weapons. I knew the difference at a young age, and I have a respect for weaponry to go along with the knowledge of their use.
Toy weapons, are just that, toys. They're used for play. Real weapons aren't used for play. They know the difference, and I'm quite confident in that.

That show is chalk full of crap to be worried about. Their props are the least of those worries. In fact, as far as what they do, say, etc....props aren't even on the radar. It's no better than toddlers in tiaras. All for ratings and attention, lol.
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  #19  
February 24th, 2012, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Linzie View Post
So i saw on Yahoo, this show "Dance Moms" which features young girls and their mothers in competitive dance. This certain number was called "Private Eye" and had the girls using gold plastic guns as a prop.

Primetime in No Time: Recaps & Clips From Last Night's Shows | Yahoo! TV (they just have a link to Prime Time in no time, but it should pull up, if not the videos are titled "Dance Moms - Clip 1" or "Clip 2". I'll try to see if i can find a specific link.)

At first, the mothers were horrified at the idea of their daughters carrying around guns, but it showed later in the video at the competition one mom said "I wish i could have been horrified by the guns, but they were better than i thought."

I know some of you may not agree with the whole dance thing (think the girls dancing to Single Ladies a while back) but from what i saw of the routine, and the theme in general, I don't think this was all that bad. One of the girls said "I know the difference between a real gun and plastic gun, and I wouldn't touch a real gun."

Was it really that bad for the dance instructor to use a gun as a prop for the dance routine? What would you have done?

Edited to add: Is there any situation would you be ok with your child using/playing with a *toy* gun?
Pretending that Dance Moms wasn't all trash, I wouldn't condemn "toy guns". I do think the problem with real guns is that children aren't taught about them. Parents ( I see this all the time) hide the gun in a closet on the top shelf, never talking about it. That's a recipe for disaster. Does something bad happen all the time? I don't think so, but the fact that these parents are too afraid to discuss their weapons can backfire on them. If you are going to have a gun in your house, hiding it and pretending it's not there is not helping anyone. There is really no excuse to own one if not everyone in the house is taught about it at the appropriate age, what it's for, how to use it, why you have it, when it's used, etc. Like a PP said, weapons should be respected.
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  #20  
February 24th, 2012, 07:28 PM
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We don't have any toy guns in our house. I'll allow water guns and nerf guns if my kids ever want them, but that's it. I pray that Avery and Maliyah never ask to get into dance (that kind), I don't know what I'll do. Avery is in ballet but I do actually hope she doesn't want to do it when she's a pre-teen and there starts being issues with competition and body image and stuff.
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