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  #1  
August 2nd, 2012, 12:52 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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Ets say you have an almost 19 year old just graduating high school. He has a college completely paid for by grandparents and has a new car coming. (grandparents).
He decides he's not going to college but is going to work in the family store which he just got caught stealing liquor from.

Do you continue to allow him to live at home for free? Pay his cell bill , insurance , groceries, electricity, housing, etc. ?
Or is this type of thing reserved for children who continue their education?
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  #2  
August 2nd, 2012, 12:59 PM
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Is he working in the family store so he can run it one day? Because if so I would view that under the heading of college because it's like a working internship.
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  #3  
August 2nd, 2012, 01:03 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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No. The store is on the market to be sold. His uncle runs it for his grandparents.
He was "given" his stock boy job and earns $300 a week in cash. And I caught him with liquor he stole from work. And no, he's not of the legal age.
He put the whole store at risk by drinking. If he were caught with it or drink and driving, the store would likely be responsible.

My issue is not that he's not going to college. It's that he's working, keeping all his money, and not paying any bills. What's the plan? He has no plan! And once the liquor store closes, he has no job.
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  #4  
August 2nd, 2012, 01:08 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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He also lacks the "capacity" to find another job that will even pay $300 a week minus taxes. The best he can land is McDs. And even they didnt call him back after he applied. I feel like his family is setting him up for life failure. =\
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  #5  
August 2nd, 2012, 01:45 PM
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no, if he has a job he needs to pay bills and maybe he should go to a trade school if he doesn't wanna go to college.. a lot of people would KILL to have a full ride to school.. he needs to learn responsibility , the sooner the better.
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  #6  
August 2nd, 2012, 02:48 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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That's my view. But dh and his whole family pretty much think he should be able to stay home free since he's working. I think he's ungrateful and very irresponsible. I'm pretty ticked off that he was laying up in our house drinking while we were on vacation. Very irresponsible.
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  #7  
August 2nd, 2012, 05:28 PM
Rachel's Avatar Just Rachel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodlebug06 View Post
Ets say you have an almost 19 year old just graduating high school. He has a college completely paid for by grandparents and has a new car coming. (grandparents).
He decides he's not going to college but is going to work in the family store which he just got caught stealing liquor from.

Do you continue to allow him to live at home for free? Pay his cell bill , insurance , groceries, electricity, housing, etc. ?
Or is this type of thing reserved for children who continue their education?
I don't believe in making a child pay rent. Unless they come home with a spouse and a child then that's a different story. Cell bill? Perhaps if it's on a family plan. It probably runs only $10-$20 a month anyway. Insurance? Do you mean health insurance or auto? Health, absolutely. Auto? No, if they are working, they should buy their own policy or contribute to the family policy.

I have adult children living at home (they are 21 and 23). I have them contribute to the family cell phone bill and they pay their own auto insurance if they have their own car. Neither are going to school. My daughter has a daughter and she buys her own groceries, but that's because she likes to have her own things. If I cook a big meal, I don't deny her though.

As for stealing, that absolutely needs to be addressed. He should probably be looking for another job.
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  #8  
August 2nd, 2012, 06:21 PM
K.A.T's Avatar Enjoying her Sticky Bun
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All my kids know, especially my eldest, that if you don't go to school you can't live here for free. You have two choices in my house, college = live for free or work = pay your own way. I don't know if I'll charge rent per say, but I will expect contributions to the house.
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  #9  
August 2nd, 2012, 08:57 PM
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Everyone is meant to live a different path. If a kid has a great ability to cook, they don't necessarily have to go to culinary school, because a degree isn't going to make them anymore likely to land a job. But being able to live at home and save up money to open up their own restaurant CAN be helpful. (Maybe some business classes)

While I don't think working necessarily equals having to pay I do think he needs a plan or some guidance figuring out what he wants out of life.
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  #10  
August 2nd, 2012, 11:52 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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Im ok with him not going to college as long as he has a plan for supporting himself and an exit plan for moving out.

I don't think he can possibly fathom how he will pay for rent/mortgage and living expenses if he has a crappy job. He's only making $300 week now because his family gave him the job. And again the store will be sold soon.

I was talking about car insurance. We lost our medical insurance when I lost my job
But even if we had it, he couldn't stay on our policy if he wasn't in college.

So he needs to get his own health plan anyway as his dad and I don't qualify for personal plans.

Car insurance is another can of worms. He's had 2 wrecks in 6 months. (over 10k in damage and one car he hit was totaled). He got a ticket and hid it from us. It was for failure to yield to police. And yes, he put the blame on the police car.

Nothing is EVER his fault. He has no responsibility. And his phone isn't $20 month. It's a fully functional smart phone. Around $65 a month.

My idea is for him to pay:
$200 month to rent
15% of the utility bill
His own phone bill
His own car insurance and upkeep of car
Either $100 month to food or buy his own "major" groceries.

I'd also say any of the rent he pays us, I would put in an account to give back to him when he does finally get his own place rather buying or renting. That money would either pay his deposit and first few months rent or go towards a down payment on a house. I wouldn't tell him this up front though. I want him to have the feeling that he's paying the bills and reducing his income by his expenses.
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  #11  
August 3rd, 2012, 07:24 AM
Rachel's Avatar Just Rachel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodlebug06 View Post

My idea is for him to pay:
$200 month to rent
15% of the utility bill
His own phone bill
His own car insurance and upkeep of car
Either $100 month to food or buy his own "major" groceries.
That's a lot for a kid fresh out of high school, with a $1200 a month take home. Insurance alone runs a boy under age 25 (at least in Maryland) close to $300 a month. He absolutely should have to pay that, but another $300 for groceries and rent and then a contribution to utilities?
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  #12  
August 3rd, 2012, 07:36 AM
ShesaDreamer's Avatar If Only. If Only <3
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My oldest DSS moved back home about 2 years ago. He pay;s his own cell bill, car insurance and he pays $50 a week in groceries. He can either spend that on stuff he wants to eat or he can pitch in and I will get groceries with it. Even if he buys stuff he want's I don't tell him he can't eat with the family. But my DSS is a big boy. So he eats probably more than $50 a week. We don't make him pay utilities because him being here doesn't change them. We would be paying the same regardless.
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  #13  
August 3rd, 2012, 07:38 AM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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His insurance is only $85 month since he's on our policy.
Obviously it's going up on our next renewal since he's been such an irresponsible driver.
Mind you both wrecks he's had were directly his fault. The first one was being careless pulling out of a parking area. Second one he wasn't even allowed to be driving while raining and left the house even after I told him not to.
So should we pay that extra insurance cost when he's bringing extra charges on himself?

Again as far as rent, id be saving his rent payment up for him to use when he moves out.
$1200 take home in cash per month is a lot for an 18 year old. That's higher than minimum wage here and he's not having taxes taken. If he lived on his own he wouldn't even survive on that.

I'll also add that he puts NOTHING into the housed. No help in the yard, no help cleaning the house, doesn't clean his bathroom and his room is completely disgusting. Trash and debris from one end to the other. Our other kids share tiny rooms while he has the biggest room. Our baby shares a room with us. He's given everything he could want living here and puts nothing into the household and my husband refuses to make him do anything.
Is all of this *really* helping him or setting him up for failure as an *adult*.
Oh dh says his son is an adult.
I think there is more to being an adult than being 18.
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  #14  
August 3rd, 2012, 07:49 AM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShesaDreamer
My oldest DSS moved back home about 2 years ago. He pay;s his own cell bill, car insurance and he pays $50 a week in groceries. He can either spend that on stuff he wants to eat or he can pitch in and I will get groceries with it. Even if he buys stuff he want's I don't tell him he can't eat with the family. But my DSS is a big boy. So he eats probably more than $50 a week. We don't make him pay utilities because him being here doesn't change them. We would be paying the same regardless.
Yeah ss definitely eats here and no we would never deny him food. But there are nights id like to just cook a nice meal for dh and I when the other kids are gone. I always have to include him even if it's $40 steaks we eat together.
My thought is , "when will this end? " "when will we have time alone where I don't have to cater to another grown man I'm not married to? "

I also stopped including him in many prepared meals for a long time because he kept complaining about my cooking in front of the other kids, making jokes of it and at one point calling one of my meals disgusting in front of his girlfriend who was visiting from Texas.
There's a lot of negativity between us which I don't want to deal with "forever". I'd like an exit plan in place.
While I've had issues with him, I WANT him to be a responsible adult and be able to take care of himself. I feel like he's being groomed for failure.
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  #15  
August 3rd, 2012, 07:55 AM
Super Mommy
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Posts: 971
The rule for my house it you are either in school full time or you work full time.

If you want to eat something special you buy it. If you want fancier cell phones you buy it. Car and Car insurance is the kids expense.
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  #16  
August 3rd, 2012, 08:53 AM
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I paid all the bills from 15-18 with 900$ a month, because my mom was an alcoholic and couldn't keep a job.
at 19 , he is not an "adult" I remember myself at 19.. but he will never grow up if he doesn't have some responsibility.
maybe if he had to get a real job where he wasn't getting 1200 a month he will see he really does need some kind of education to get somewhere in life . DH's dad is 56 years old and is living at home with his mother and step father , he gets a job for about two weeks then quits and they pay for ALL his stuff, so why should he move? he has a free ride?!
I'm not saying kick him out, but he should pay bills, and maybe not rent (gotta pick your battles) but make him do a list of things at the house . I mean if he can't clean or pick up after himself how will he manage his own house?
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  #17  
August 3rd, 2012, 11:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodlebug06 View Post
Im ok with him not going to college as long as he has a plan for supporting himself and an exit plan for moving out.

I don't think he can possibly fathom how he will pay for rent/mortgage and living expenses if he has a crappy job. He's only making $300 week now because his family gave him the job. And again the store will be sold soon.

I was talking about car insurance. We lost our medical insurance when I lost my job
But even if we had it, he couldn't stay on our policy if he wasn't in college.

So he needs to get his own health plan anyway as his dad and I don't qualify for personal plans.

Car insurance is another can of worms. He's had 2 wrecks in 6 months. (over 10k in damage and one car he hit was totaled). He got a ticket and hid it from us. It was for failure to yield to police. And yes, he put the blame on the police car.

Nothing is EVER his fault. He has no responsibility. And his phone isn't $20 month. It's a fully functional smart phone. Around $65 a month.

My idea is for him to pay:
$200 month to rent
15% of the utility bill
His own phone bill
His own car insurance and upkeep of car
Either $100 month to food or buy his own "major" groceries.

I'd also say any of the rent he pays us, I would put in an account to give back to him when he does finally get his own place rather buying or renting. That money would either pay his deposit and first few months rent or go towards a down payment on a house. I wouldn't tell him this up front though. I want him to have the feeling that he's paying the bills and reducing his income by his expenses.
I don't like dishonesty. I'm all for taking some money in "rent" to help him save for a place of his own but I'd be upfront about that. And I wouldn't charge for the utilities unless he's actually jacking them up. I also wouldn't base contributions on the job he has if you know the store is closing and that he won't have that job for much longer. It's not realistic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodlebug06 View Post
His insurance is only $85 month since he's on our policy.
Obviously it's going up on our next renewal since he's been such an irresponsible driver.
Mind you both wrecks he's had were directly his fault. The first one was being careless pulling out of a parking area. Second one he wasn't even allowed to be driving while raining and left the house even after I told him not to.
So should we pay that extra insurance cost when he's bringing extra charges on himself?

Again as far as rent, id be saving his rent payment up for him to use when he moves out.
$1200 take home in cash per month is a lot for an 18 year old. That's higher than minimum wage here and he's not having taxes taken. If he lived on his own he wouldn't even survive on that.

I'll also add that he puts NOTHING into the housed. No help in the yard, no help cleaning the house, doesn't clean his bathroom and his room is completely disgusting. Trash and debris from one end to the other. Our other kids share tiny rooms while he has the biggest room. Our baby shares a room with us. He's given everything he could want living here and puts nothing into the household and my husband refuses to make him do anything.
Is all of this *really* helping him or setting him up for failure as an *adult*.
Oh dh says his son is an adult.
I think there is more to being an adult than being 18.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doodlebug06 View Post
Yeah ss definitely eats here and no we would never deny him food. But there are nights id like to just cook a nice meal for dh and I when the other kids are gone. I always have to include him even if it's $40 steaks we eat together.
My thought is , "when will this end? " "when will we have time alone where I don't have to cater to another grown man I'm not married to? "

I also stopped including him in many prepared meals for a long time because he kept complaining about my cooking in front of the other kids, making jokes of it and at one point calling one of my meals disgusting in front of his girlfriend who was visiting from Texas.
There's a lot of negativity between us which I don't want to deal with "forever". I'd like an exit plan in place.
While I've had issues with him, I WANT him to be a responsible adult and be able to take care of himself. I feel like he's being groomed for failure.
I feel like this is less about his current readiness for the world and more about his past lack of respect for your home and your husband's lack of support for your concerns and lack of validation of your feelings. (I probably stepped all over all sorts of line and I'm sorry but I'm generally upfront. I mean no harm I promise. ) It just seems like it's all built up and you have a lot of resentment which I totally understand. Everyone should be able to clean up after themselves. Everyone won't be as neat as the next person but they should be able to keep their home from being condemned. That really needs to be the starting point. It doesn't sound like he has any sense of personal responsibility which is going to make teaching him responsibility as it applies to the real world hard.
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  #19  
August 3rd, 2012, 12:56 PM
Rachel's Avatar Just Rachel
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So he's not paying taxes on his income? At all? That's uh, kind of illegal.
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  #20  
August 3rd, 2012, 04:10 PM
Doodlebug06's Avatar Doodlebug
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Ok. Let me elaborate.
He would still get all sorts of cash from the grandparents even if he wasn't working. So the tax thing isn't an issue. The money they "give" him for working is their money. They own the store and every ounce of liquor in it. No liens or loans. The Point of saying its $300 a week is so you know it's not like he's getting any deductions. He straight takes $300 a week. His uncle is big on following rules and all and I'm sure he has the store pay the taxes. That's what he did for the other brother that worked there. He had a certain take home amount.

There is NO where he can go work for that amount. And obviously if the store is sold and he's not having an actual income, we wouldn't expect him to pay anything until he got another job. But how will he get another one with no experience or education =\

Even his job at the store, he's not pulling his full weight. He leaves empty stuff laying around, they have to tell him over and over what to do, he can't just go "do" stuff, he has to be told. Same stuff he does at home!

You are prob right that a lot of this is about my issues with him. But I have valid issues! I'm a grown woman being forced to take care of a "grown man" who doesn't want to be responsible. He wants the freedom of an adult life but not the responsibility. I don't see that as fair to us and I don't see it as helping his future to do it?
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