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Recurrent M/c (xposted)


Forum: Trying to Conceive with Medical Assistance

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  #1  
June 28th, 2011, 01:36 PM
cavewoman's Avatar #2 due in June!
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Pretty recently we had our 4th m/c. The first 3 were chemical pregnancies and the 4th I had bleeding start at 9w5d but doctors seem to think growth stopped more at like 7 weeks. I had a non diagnostic u/s done at 6w5d and a heartbeat was detected. The lovely military doctors lied to my face at my u/s to confirm the loss at "10 weeks" and said no testing could be done on the tissue except to confirm whether it was actually fetal tissue I guess? I was too upset to fight it and just let it go. The tiny sample they took (which mind you was done after I had passed clots for 2-3 days) came back as not having been fetal tissue though we saw shreds on the u/s. I'm sorry if I'm too graphic in my description I just don't know any other way to describe it. Anyway, I finally got my referral to see an RE and the RE said I have a little more blood testing to be done and wants to do a hysteroscopy. He seems to think that because we've had 4 losses in a years time its likely an egg quality issue. He said the chances of finding something thru the remaining testing is less than 5% and if nothing is found, he is recommending IVF so they can weed out the "bad eggs." Does this sound right to anyone? It seems so drastic to me. I mean, I always thought IVF was for those who weren't able to become pregnant on their own at all? He told me to be careful and avoid pregnancy because I am set up for failure as it stands until we know the cause.
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  #2  
June 28th, 2011, 01:40 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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It can make sense on two levels. Your eggs may be genetically compromised and they can see that in the lab before you transfer. You may also have high levels of natural killer cells which need immune tx before trying again
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  #3  
June 28th, 2011, 02:26 PM
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It does sound drastic in a way, but I agree that it makes sense. If you have already had other RPL testing that came back okay, IVF might be the only way to find out what is going on and work around it. (((HUGS))) I'm sorry you are having such a rotten time.
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  #4  
June 28th, 2011, 03:00 PM
hollann1984's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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Im sorry Bonnie! I really hope these tests can help you figure out why this keeps happening. We have been on JM since about the same time so I always follow you and hope for the best. Let us know how the testing goes!
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  #5  
June 28th, 2011, 03:14 PM
Lash's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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And a side note.. Genetic testing on you wont tell you if your eggs have are genetically comprimised in lots of cases. Ivf will tell you that though
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  #6  
June 28th, 2011, 04:24 PM
luvmykids623's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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It does make sense, and it also seems drastic. I hope that the tests show something with an easy fix. Have you been tested for MTHFR?
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  #7  
June 28th, 2011, 05:19 PM
*SamF*'s Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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IVF too me may be drastic, discuss your options, after testing. I have egg quality issues, so we are making more eggs in the chance of getting a good one. It worked before for me. Some RE's push IVF as the only answer, it's not for everyone. Also IVF even with genetic testing isn't 100% if your not looking for specific disorders, basic or random chromosomal issues are very hard to pinpoint therefore hard to test for.
Don't get discouraged, there are options out there and testing will help.

Good luck!
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  #8  
June 28th, 2011, 06:41 PM
foodieinFL's Avatar Veteran
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There could be many reasons for the m/c, other than egg quality. Have you had a laparoscopy? Sorry about your losses.
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TTC #1 since 4/08
Unexplained IF
5/09: HSG-clear tubes
6/09: Cycle #1 clomid/ovidrel/progesterone =
7/09: Cycle #2 clomid/ovidrel/progesterone =
11/10: Lap-removed very mild endo, corrected uterine septum
6/11: IUI #1 w/ Gonal F, Ovidrel, progesterone = canceled (overstimulated on meds)
7/11: IUI #2 w/ Gonal F, Ovidrel, progesterone =
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9/11:
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  #9  
June 28th, 2011, 06:54 PM
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Hi Bonnie - I am so sad for you; this stuff is so emotionally draining

I read what you wrote about IVf only being for women that can not have babies. I have been seeing an RE for months now and have been TTC for almost a year. The tests have shown nothing wrong with myself, or , my husband. The educated guess is that my age is playing a factor, 37, as well as borderline MIS tests that measure ovarian reserve. Could I get pg on my own? Definitely, as I have had 2 chemicals. I could keep trying and maybe it will happen naturally. HOwever, given my age and FSH levels on certain cycles, that were 10 - not horrible but not wonderful, we are going forward with it next cycle.

There is no guarantee that it will work, but, I do believe that it will give us the best chance at this particular time.

I am sure that you must be beside yourself, especially when you were not planning on moving to IVF right now.
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  #10  
June 29th, 2011, 07:17 AM
Em2528's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Im sorry for your losses and all you are dealing with. If you dont mind me asking, how old are you? I am just wondering because I am 24, and have had 8 miscarriages in the last 4 years and after reading your post, im on to something wondering about my egg quality now. Is IVF the only way to test egg quality? With how many losses we have been through, I pretty much feel the same way about being set up for failure if I become pg again, since we dont know the cause. Please let me know if you find out anything else, as I want to look into it myself.
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  #11  
June 29th, 2011, 08:00 AM
♥Ashley♥'s Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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I am also 24 (same as Erika) and been through 4 definite miscarriages and 2 more suspected (multiple BFP's but never got darker). No RE has ever mentioned egg quality to me, but over the last few months I have been thinking about it. Especially a couple weeks ago when I was getting all of my medical records together to mail to our new RE and noticed my eggs always seem to be HUGE before I actually release them. It is definitely something I am going to bring up with our new RE. I've also been told that the more miscarriages you endure the more your body "fights off" a pregnancy any time you become pregnant again and sees it as foreign.

Good Luck to you!!
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Cycle #1-9 - All Natural....5BFN's, 4BFP's (all ended in miscarriage)
Cycle #10-11 - Met with first RE, diagnosed with heterzygeous MTHFR mutation & slightly low SA on all counts. -BFN, Cycle #12 - First IUI+Trigger - BFN, Cycle #13 - BFN
Cycle #14-15 - Met with new RE, diagnosed with a blocked right tube that previous RE completely overlooked or didnt care to mention. Soy (120mg) - BFN
Cycle #16 - Clomid (100mg) - BFN, Cycle #17 - Clomid (100mg)+Trigger+IUI - BFN
Cycle #18 - Acupuncture+Clomid (100mg) - BFN
Cycle #19-27 - 2 Soy (160mg) cycles, the rest all natural also 30lbs lost!! - BFN's
Cycle #28 - New RE is GREAT! Put on bcp 7/6/11, Lap surgery 8/1/11- Tubal cyst (5cm) found and removed, Uterine Septum removed, and Stage II-III endo removed. Cycle #29 - All Natural - BFN, Cycle #30 - All Natural - BFN, Cycle#31 - All Natural - BFN, DONE TTC FOR NOW




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  #12  
June 29th, 2011, 08:15 AM
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Hi Bonnie, i think we were in the Sept. DDC together. I'm so sorry for your losses. IVF does sound drastic, but i don't know enough to say if it sounds like your only option. I do think wttc until you have some answers is a good idea. I have diminished egg quality, our plan is Clomid, trigger, Prometrium. My RE said the idea is to increase the chances that a "good" egg will release. I have only had 2 losses, but i am not getting pregnant very easily either. I hope the testing gives you the answers you need to get your rainbow baby.
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  #13  
June 29th, 2011, 08:30 AM
cavewoman's Avatar #2 due in June!
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Have you been tested for MTHFR?
I'm not even sure what that is and on this list of testing that will be done and hasn't I don't even see that?

Looks like what was done is:
TSH
ABO & Rh
Rubella
Chromosome Analysis
Hepatitis B Surface Antigen HbSAg
RPR/VDRI

and whats left to do is:
FSH
Estradiol Level E2
Prolactin
ATA & AMA/TPO
APA
ASA
Chlamydia Antibody
HCV
HIV
HTLV

and then the Cervical cultures & Hysteroscopy

And they've already done semen analysis and I believe a chromosome analysis on DH as well - not sure if they did the Hepatitis, RPR/VDRI, HIV & HTLV on Dh yet though - need to get the copy of his testing for the doc to know.

Have you had a laparoscopy?
My OB was going to do one before I went to the RE but I got my appt so fast it didn't happen. When I mentioned this to the RE he seemed to think doing a hysteroscopy would be the better choice so they can see better INSIDE the uterus - he felt the HSG would be for issues in the tubes which are clearly open as I'm becoming pregnant left & right no problem?

How old are you? Is IVF the only way to test egg quality?
25 and from what I understood from the RE - I think so. The way he explained it - and this is my interpretation - they'll pull the eggs & be able to separate the good from the bad. He also mentioned something though about giving me medications to stimulate & create more eggs to be tested? But now that I think of it I'm not sure that was something separate, or a part of the IVF process? I think I just became stunned at "IVF" and went into a daze.. lol

No RE has ever mentioned egg quality to me
At my appt he said to me "what do you think is the leading cause I see of recurrent miscarriages like yours?" and I was like ?????? hoping for some stupid easy fix answer.. and then he said "egg quality"


Thank you all for your support!! I wish you all lots of luck in your TTC ventures.. this frustration is for the birds!

Quote:
Originally Posted by erinangele View Post
Hi Bonnie, i think we were in the Sept. DDC together. I'm so sorry for your losses. IVF does sound drastic, but i don't know enough to say if it sounds like your only option. I do think wttc until you have some answers is a good idea. I have diminished egg quality, our plan is Clomid, trigger, Prometrium. My RE said the idea is to increase the chances that a "good" egg will release. I have only had 2 losses, but i am not getting pregnant very easily either. I hope the testing gives you the answers you need to get your rainbow baby.
How did you come to the conclusion that its "diminished egg quality"?? Is it the clomid & trigger that are supposed to increase chances of a good egg? This is definitely a less drastic route though I guess everyones situation is different.. I will have to find out about this though!
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  #14  
June 29th, 2011, 08:37 AM
♥Ashley♥'s Avatar Platinum Supermommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cavewoman View Post
Have you been tested for MTHFR?
I'm not even sure what that is and on this list of testing that will be done and hasn't I don't even see that?
MTHFR is a part of the genetic testing, if you havent had that done you do need to get it done for sure. After my 3rd loss, I was found to have a heterozygeous MTHFR gene mutation, I was so excited after finding that because I thought now we know the cause and can treat it. Well, I have the mildest form of the mutation and most Dr's wont even do anything to treat it...so that is where I have been stuck at for over a year now. I still do think there is some other issue though.

But you should definitely get the genetic testing done on yourself if you havent already.
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Cycle #1-9 - All Natural....5BFN's, 4BFP's (all ended in miscarriage)
Cycle #10-11 - Met with first RE, diagnosed with heterzygeous MTHFR mutation & slightly low SA on all counts. -BFN, Cycle #12 - First IUI+Trigger - BFN, Cycle #13 - BFN
Cycle #14-15 - Met with new RE, diagnosed with a blocked right tube that previous RE completely overlooked or didnt care to mention. Soy (120mg) - BFN
Cycle #16 - Clomid (100mg) - BFN, Cycle #17 - Clomid (100mg)+Trigger+IUI - BFN
Cycle #18 - Acupuncture+Clomid (100mg) - BFN
Cycle #19-27 - 2 Soy (160mg) cycles, the rest all natural also 30lbs lost!! - BFN's
Cycle #28 - New RE is GREAT! Put on bcp 7/6/11, Lap surgery 8/1/11- Tubal cyst (5cm) found and removed, Uterine Septum removed, and Stage II-III endo removed. Cycle #29 - All Natural - BFN, Cycle #30 - All Natural - BFN, Cycle#31 - All Natural - BFN, DONE TTC FOR NOW




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  #15  
June 29th, 2011, 08:40 AM
cavewoman's Avatar #2 due in June!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ♥Ashley♥ View Post
MTHFR is a part of the genetic testing, if you havent had that done you do need to get it done for sure. After my 3rd loss, I was found to have a heterozygeous MTHFR gene mutation, I was so excited after finding that because I thought now we know the cause and can treat it. Well, I have the mildest form of the mutation and most Dr's wont even do anything to treat it...so that is where I have been stuck at for over a year now. I still do think there is some other issue though.

But you should definitely get the genetic testing done on yourself if you havent already.
Thank you. I have written it down and will ask about it!
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  #16  
June 29th, 2011, 09:24 AM
foodieinFL's Avatar Veteran
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Bonnie- definitely ask about MTHFR. I am MTHFR homozygous (meaning I have 2 copies of the mutation, not just one). My regular OB placed me on RX folic acid, as well as daily baby aspirin. If I do become pg, (never have), I will need to be placed on daily blood thinning injections. The biggest risk with the disease is developing blood clots, which can lead to m/c, especially in early pg.
Also, I had a lap/hysteroscopy this past November which revealed a uterine septum. Basically, it's extra tissue that forms across the top of the uterus and can progress, literally dividing the uterus in half. I just had tissue that formed across the top. If an egg tries to implant on this tissue, it can't survive, (no blood flow), and can cause m/c. Mine was easily corrected, and does not recur. Apparently it is a birth defect. Hope you get some answers soon!
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Me: 36, very mild endo, MTHFR
Hubby: 37, perfect
TTC #1 since 4/08
Unexplained IF
5/09: HSG-clear tubes
6/09: Cycle #1 clomid/ovidrel/progesterone =
7/09: Cycle #2 clomid/ovidrel/progesterone =
11/10: Lap-removed very mild endo, corrected uterine septum
6/11: IUI #1 w/ Gonal F, Ovidrel, progesterone = canceled (overstimulated on meds)
7/11: IUI #2 w/ Gonal F, Ovidrel, progesterone =
Lost my job. Taking a short break from MA
8/11: Natural cycle =
9/11:
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  #17  
June 29th, 2011, 02:18 PM
frankie's Avatar Proud Mommy
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Hi
Sorry to hear about your losses.. I wouldnt say you need IVF right away...

I had 4 m/c and they are horrible mine were all early too I couldnt get out of the first trimester.. I went to an RE he ran test EVERYTHING came back normal huband and me... I did IUI with trigger and they found that once I Ovulate I dont produce enough progesterone to hold a pregnancy.. So they put me on prometrium 3 days after trigger 2 times a day with endometrium..

So I think You should get all the testing done.. I did hsg blood work genetic and they can test your progesterone 7 days after u Ovulate to see if you produce enough..

And then see what the next step should be...

Lots of luck I hope it all turns out great for you
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  #18  
June 29th, 2011, 03:31 PM
cavewoman's Avatar #2 due in June!
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This most recently pregnancy I was actually on progesterone 200 mg nightly to try and help sustain as well as 81mg of aspirin for clotting and the pregnancy held on longer but still didn't make it work ;\

A friend just recommended I get tested for a gluten intolerance so I have asked the doc to add that to the list of testing for me as well. It is apparently known to cause spontaneous abortion and often goes unseen because doctors dont even think to test for it.
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  #19  
June 29th, 2011, 05:52 PM
Jessie0505's Avatar Finally a Mommy!
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I have no advice..i know how insensitve military drs can be though and im so sorry you are having to go through all of this!! I hope that you are able to figure out what is going on here and im terribly sorry for all of your losses. I hope you get some answers soon! HUGS! hun!
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