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Folic acid vs. folate HELP!


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  • 1 Post By Rainbow Catcher
  • 1 Post By ChiChica
  • 2 Post By Rainbow Catcher
  • 1 Post By Lucy S.
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  • 1 Post By plan4fate

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  #1  
March 6th, 2014, 09:25 PM
Lucy S.'s Avatar POAS addict
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Someone mentioned on my ddc about folate vs. folic acid and said NOT take folic acid. Provided this link:The little known difference between folate and folic acid

So now I feel foolish for taking not only taking an additional folic acid supplement (per my RE), but also my prenatal I have taken for years (Rainbow Light- uses folic acid instead of folate).

Am I missing something?
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  #2  
March 6th, 2014, 09:35 PM
plan4fate's Avatar I may bend, but not break
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folic acid needs to be converted to use. Some don't convert enough to be useful.

I take the Rainbow lite prenatal.. and I won't discontinue until I'm finished the gigantonormous bottle or I get prescribed one with out it... but I also take 800mcg Folate on top of it.

I've been making a point to buy bio-identical supplements when I need to refresh my bottles. Co Q10 B6 and B12 also have forms you don't need to convert to use. My body's already a pain in my rear, I don't want to ask it to work harder to do something simple.. cause it would likely just flip me off.
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Me: Hashi's, PCOS, Insulin resistant, Adenomyosis and Polyps.
175mcg Synthyroid, 1500mg Metformin
Colposcopy = CIN1+CIN2 cells
D&C/Hysterscopy/Polypectomy - August 21st - Follow up Sept 4
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Seeing MFI specialist/RE in 2015. Vitamins started August 2nd
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Last edited by plan4fate; March 6th, 2014 at 09:39 PM.
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  #3  
March 6th, 2014, 10:33 PM
swtneka's Avatar Praying for a miracle
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Hattiesburg, Ms
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hmm... guess back to the vitamin store...

now that I think about it my Dr told me to get iron pills and to make sure they say folate.
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  #4  
March 7th, 2014, 04:38 AM
Liyana's Avatar Super Mommy
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Hmm I don't know what to say,,, But I have been taking Folic acid 400 approx some days after when my first IVF failed. Am I doing something wrong now?
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Our history
DH 24 ME 27

TTC since Mai 2012

IVF/ICSI #1
ER: 14.01.14 (retrived 14 eggs, 8 was mature, all 8 fertilized)
ET: 17.01.14 (One, 8 cell perfect embryo transfered, 5 frosties)
BETA: 13dp3dpt, 30.01.2014
BFP on Clearblue digi on 30th January, FMU, before my BETA
1st BETA 49,
2nd BETA 3 Feb. 2014. was 120...
Our IVF failed...AF came 9.02.14

IVF #2
FET was scheduled 4.04.14
5 frosties didn`t survived the night...their`s development stopped..


IVF/ICSI #3
ER: 17.06.14 (retrived 12 eggs, 6 fertilized)
ET: 19.06.14 ( Two, 4-cell embies transfered) BFN!! 3 frosties

BETA: 14dp2dt, 03.07.14 Negative

IVF#4
FET is planned in beginning in September



Last edited by Liyana; March 12th, 2014 at 05:59 AM.
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  #5  
March 7th, 2014, 05:03 AM
Rainbow Catcher's Avatar Bound and Determined
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Ok.. so this I know about (after doing weeks of research on it because I have 2 MTHFR mutations)... If you don't have a mutation(s) in your MTHFR gene, then theoretically, you should be fine. Your body should be converting the folic acid into folate properly, and that should be available for your body to use.

If you have a MTHFR mutation, then you should NOT take folic acid because your body can't break it down.. and so the synthetic folic acid builds up in your system and can't be used the way it was meant to be. Not to mention, there is harm that can come with the build up.

Now, knowing what I know now...and looking at other things out there, there are some studies that link folic acid with increased risks of other issues even for people without MTHFR probelms... and Dr. Furhman (very public doc, you see him on documentaries like "Fat Sick and Nearly Dead" and he's written lots of books like "Eat to Live") warns for everyone to switch to folate (see this article): Don't take Multi's with Folic Acid, Including Prenatal Vitamins
He also sells vitamins, but they're incredibly expensive... and there ARE other choices out there.

Chances are, if you don't have a MTHFR problem, your body is getting enough to sustain a healthy pregnancy, so don't think you're doing anything wrong. But at the same time, there's info out there that says switching may be better for your health. Hope this helps some.
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  #6  
March 7th, 2014, 05:13 AM
Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plan4fate View Post
folic acid needs to be converted to use. Some don't convert enough to be useful.
^This!

Most people don't have an issue converting, so that's why most supplements are the standard "folic acid" instead of folate. (Plus, it's cheaper!) I'm on 4000mcg of 5-MTHFR daily, which is pretty high, but it's what was prescribed to me.
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Me: Autoimmune (Hashimotos and Fibromyalgia), vitamin D and calcium deficiency. Treated with Synthroid, supplements, TCM and acupuncture.

DH: Severe MFI (low counts, low motility, poor morphology and high antibodies), likely caused by poor liver function. Treated with Clomid to increase total counts.

DD: Conceived after 1 year of TTC with progesterone to correct LPD (likely caused by undiagnosed thyroid dysfunction). Born Aug 2009 via c/s after an induction due to pre-e and HELLP.

TTC #2 since Oct10 with an early loss in Aug 2011. Post-wash counts are too low for IUI to be successful, so moving on to IVF/ICSI in May 2014!

IVF/ICSI #1 (May 2014): Estrogen priming and antagonist protocol, including acupuncture and prayer!
17/05/14 - Baseline looks good, start Gonal-F 225iu and Luveris 75iu
28/05/14 - 18 eggs retrieved, 14 mature
29/05/14 - 13 fertilized!!! All are looking great still on day 3, so we're going to blast!
02/06/14 - Transferred one 1BC blast, with 3 other blasts and 3 morulas to watch and freeze
03/06/14 - All embryos have arrested. None to freeze
09/06/14 - Faint BFP at home at 7dp5dt!!!!!
10/06/14 - Beta?

Last edited by muffin; March 7th, 2014 at 05:17 AM.
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  #7  
March 7th, 2014, 05:23 AM
Rainbow Catcher's Avatar Bound and Determined
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nice, Muffin - do you have MTHFR issues?? Or is your doc just really in tune!?
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  #8  
March 7th, 2014, 05:29 AM
Mega Super Mommy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rainbow Catcher View Post
nice, Muffin - do you have MTHFR issues?? Or is your doc just really in tune!?
No issues that we know of, my ND is just really awesome! My homocysteine levels are normal, but I have alot of the issues that are associated with the gene mutation. We didn't get the genetic testing for it, since we figured that the treatment would be the same.
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Me: Autoimmune (Hashimotos and Fibromyalgia), vitamin D and calcium deficiency. Treated with Synthroid, supplements, TCM and acupuncture.

DH: Severe MFI (low counts, low motility, poor morphology and high antibodies), likely caused by poor liver function. Treated with Clomid to increase total counts.

DD: Conceived after 1 year of TTC with progesterone to correct LPD (likely caused by undiagnosed thyroid dysfunction). Born Aug 2009 via c/s after an induction due to pre-e and HELLP.

TTC #2 since Oct10 with an early loss in Aug 2011. Post-wash counts are too low for IUI to be successful, so moving on to IVF/ICSI in May 2014!

IVF/ICSI #1 (May 2014): Estrogen priming and antagonist protocol, including acupuncture and prayer!
17/05/14 - Baseline looks good, start Gonal-F 225iu and Luveris 75iu
28/05/14 - 18 eggs retrieved, 14 mature
29/05/14 - 13 fertilized!!! All are looking great still on day 3, so we're going to blast!
02/06/14 - Transferred one 1BC blast, with 3 other blasts and 3 morulas to watch and freeze
03/06/14 - All embryos have arrested. None to freeze
09/06/14 - Faint BFP at home at 7dp5dt!!!!!
10/06/14 - Beta?
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  #9  
March 7th, 2014, 07:46 AM
kayakr's Avatar Persuaded by POAS’ers
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,751
Good information thanks guys I've been on just 1000 mcg of folic acid since before pregnancy, during and now while nursing. My family dr just recommend at least 400 mcg in addition to the baby asprin as well to help keep blood thin since my Cholesterol levels are getting a little high
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Me (43) DH(33) 12 years together - ttc our first together-I have 14yr old DS
Cycles 1-6 = BFN
Cycle 7 SA results abnormal morphology 2%, 50 mg clomid = BFN
Cycle 8 sonogram normal 50 mg clomid + trigger = BFN
Cycle 9 SA results abnormal morphology and motility. Count 200 mill, 100mg clomid + trigger = BFN
Cycle 10 natural = BFN
Cycle 11 hsg tubes clear, natural + trigger+IUI = BFN
Cycle 12 repronex + trigger + 2 IUI = BFN
Cycle 13 natural ovaries to stimulated for more meds = BFN
Cycle 14-22 natural cycle with Acupuncture and planning ivf/icsi/DE = ALL BFN
Cycle 23 Clomid 50 mg & Progesterone = BFN
Cycle 24 Natural = BFN
Cycle 25 BCP, SA result 7% morphology = BFN
Cycle 26 BCP and Lupron preparing for IVF
Cycle 27 IVF Acupuncture, DE Retrieval April 7, Transfer April 12 =
7 eggs retrieved, 3 fertilized, 2 transferred - zero snow babies
BETA # 1 16DPO or 11dp5dt = 569
BETA # 2 19 DPO or 14dp5dt = 1078
BETA # 3 22DPO or 17dp5dt = 2414 TWINS!
BETA # 4 30DPO or 25dp5dt = 12,685 6weeks 3days 2 heartbeats! 114 & 116
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  #10  
March 7th, 2014, 08:25 AM
*Jen*'s Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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I take New Chapter Prenatals which is a Organic Non GMO whole food vitamin. I love it. My DH takes the men's over 40 vitamin they make as well.
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  #11  
March 7th, 2014, 09:04 AM
ChiChica's Avatar Mega Super Mommy
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As a counterpoint, I'm not sure that the benefits of folate vs folic acid, even for those with MTHFR mutations have been proven. And the studies showing that supplementation can reduce the severe consequences of MTHFR used regular old folic acid. I have two MTHFR mutations and a family history of anencephaly. I take folic acid and haven't had any deleterious effects. I saw a very well-respected hematologist and asked her about this specifically. She said that because my homocysteine levels were fine on the folic acid, there was no reason to do anything different. She said there had been a lot of hope that MTHFR mutations would explain a lot of unexplained fertility/loss problems, but that it hasn't really played out that way as they've continued to research. I know there is a lot of scary stuff on the internet about needing folate, but that was my doctor's perspective, I trust her, and it has worked out for me so far. Good luck!
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  #12  
March 7th, 2014, 10:15 AM
Rainbow Catcher's Avatar Bound and Determined
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Location: Virginia
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I hope you continue to do well Chi!! I don't think changing to folate will solve all fertility problems, but it may really help some that have MTHFR issues because the pathway is broken. Throwing 5 days straight of rain on an area that is in drought doesn't solve the problem (maybe a crummy metaphor, but that's how I think of it) and can cause problems. I'm just not willing to take that chance when I know something is broken when I can easily change my supplement. Will it help? Maybe not. But I sure won't wonder if that's the reason if (heaven forbid) I have another miscarriage. It's good to hear about it from all around, but many doctors aren't really educated about it. Ultimately, you have to do what feels right for you ladies.. learn all you can and make a decision. That's this whole TTCMA battlefield, isn't it...
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  #13  
March 8th, 2014, 10:22 PM
Lucy S.'s Avatar POAS addict
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Ok I feel better... this thread has def been eye opening! Thank you ladies!!!
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  #14  
March 9th, 2014, 04:37 AM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,087
Hey Lucy- I'm late to the chat! I didn't know to avoid folic acid altogether, but my RE did say to supplement with folate for absorption. Specifically, L-methylfolate.
I use:Solgar brand folate (as metafolin) l-methylfolate 800mg

Folate 800 mcg (as Metafolin®) Tablets Solgar Vitamins, Minerals, and Herbs.
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Last edited by Sunrise; March 9th, 2014 at 04:39 AM. Reason: Provide link
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  #15  
March 9th, 2014, 09:55 AM
plan4fate's Avatar I may bend, but not break
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^^ That's the one I take, cause I'm pretty sure Sunrise mentioned it on rpl in a thread. lol
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~TTC #1 together 2 years and counting ~


Awesome siggy made by Jaidynsmum
Matthew&Mark 08/24/2005 9w1d, Mattie Anne 04/07/2008 8w Mel&Dee 01/19/2010 (8 weeks) and 5 chemical pregnancies
Hope 07/22/2012@4w1d, Konnor 11/24/2012@3w6d,"Emmy"1/15/2013@ 3w6d, Ronen 02/10/2013@3w5d, Joy 07/19/2013@3w6d, "Pea" 09/06/2013@ 3w3d

Me: Hashi's, PCOS, Insulin resistant, Adenomyosis and Polyps.
175mcg Synthyroid, 1500mg Metformin
Colposcopy = CIN1+CIN2 cells
D&C/Hysterscopy/Polypectomy - August 21st - Follow up Sept 4
Him: MFI low count, low morphology, low motillity
Seeing MFI specialist/RE in 2015. Vitamins started August 2nd
Weight loss goal #1 - 10% body weight 23.4lbs - accomplished July 13 2014
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