[Linzie]

Yeeaaah.... etiquette was the wrong word to use.

[witchofthenorth]

We always go to my husband's mom's for Thanksgiving and I never bring anything. I used to but she always had to take it into the kitchen and "fix" it. She's that type, yup. I say, if you invite me and don't ask me to bring anything, I'm not.

[Calendula]

Originally Posted by AMDG

No, where did I say anything like that? I guess it was the word "etiquette" that threw me for a loop. Sometime prior to thanksgiving the family talks about thanksgiving plans - I just meant that "etiquette" shouldn't be a concern if a family knows eachother. I would never worry - oh, is it bad etiquette for me to offer to make desserts or wow, sister-in-law Mary sure used poor etiquette in making mashed potatoes because I made them last year and she is stepping on my toes. To me, etiquette, implies the need to follow some kind of social norms or rules while courtesy is just common sense. I agree that family gatherings are more fun when no one feels taken for granted but my solution to that is to talk and make decisions together rather than to pull out an etiquette book to find out what I "should" make and bring to the family's thanksgiving dinner.

In the text I quoted, I truly thought that was what you were saying. My definition of etiquette is very different from what you've outlined here. In fact, what you post here as etiquette is very far removed from what I would consider etiquette, so there must have been a misunderstanding based on that. I don't see etiquette as unrelated to courtesy. I also don't have a concept of etiquette that precludes communication.

Originally Posted by AMDG

I agree and that was what i was getting at - I don't there is etiquette that must be followed when dealing with family. The difference between what was acceptable with your family vs. what Kes described shows that. If I showed up to a family gathering with a 2-Liter or a bag of chips people would look at me like I was absolutely crazy but that is because that is because our family dynamics are different. No right or wrong - no proper etiquette - just different.

So, it would be poor etiquette?

The expectations you are defining as dynamics, I see as a form of etiquette. I guess the main difference is you see etiquette as something stodgy and universal, I see it as something individual to different cultures and groups (even individual families). I guess that is where our arguments seemed to clash.

Originally Posted by Linzie

Yeeaaah.... etiquette was the wrong word to use.

Troublemaker!

Originally Posted by Poncho06

I rarely if ever bring anything to my parents house for the holiday other than a bottle of wine that I tap into during the meal. In fact when I was in college I would show up with tupperwear and load up before I left.

I think it depends solely on family dynamics, no one would bat an eye if you showed up empty handed at anyones home. We'll usually ask if they need anything but most times the answer is no. I'd prefer it if you didn't to anything at my home but understand if it's a traditional food I'm not offering. I usually go overboard to begin with and end up with way too much food being offered.

Originally Posted by AMDG

I agree and that was what i was getting at - I don't there is etiquette that must be followed when dealing with family. The difference between what was acceptable with your family vs. what Kes described shows that. If I showed up to a family gathering with a 2-Liter or a bag of chips people would look at me like I was absolutely crazy but that is because that is because our family dynamics are different. No right or wrong - no proper etiquette - just different.

I bring something because I feel like it's proper manners to do so, because that's what my mother taught me. No in the family but me brings anything, and no one ever brings anything to gatherings that I host. It doesn't really bother me, because I realize their standards are different. But I would feel completely rude and unmannerly if I didn't bring something. It's not even a family dynamic, since my own family doesn't expect it.. my mother just added it to her "basic manners" lesson, along with saying thank you and chewing with your mouth closed.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by Calendula

The expectations you are defining as dynamics, I see as a form of etiquette. I guess the main difference is you see etiquette as something stodgy and universal, I see it as something individual to different cultures and groups (even individual families). I guess that is where our arguments seemed to clash.

It could be that misunderstand the definition of the word. When I look it up this is what I find:

the conduct or procedure required by good breeding or prescribed by authority to be observed in social or official life

I guess I don't consider what is required by good breeding or what should be followed in one's social or official life to necessarily carry over to family gatherings. I agree it proper etiquette to bring something when you are a guest at a meal. In our society that is considered to be proper even if you are not asked to bring something. I don't think that carries over as a general rule when dealing with family gatherings. The OP had to do with what was proper etiquette when dealing with thanksgiving. I don't see how anything can be classified as universally appropriate when speaking of family gatherings like it can be usually when speaking about society in general.
Linzie has said she maybe etiquette wasn't really the word she meant and it sounds like I've become too hung up on that particular word.

[AMDG]

Originally Posted by Keskes

I bring something because I feel like it's proper manners to do so, because that's what my mother taught me. No in the family but me brings anything, and no one ever brings anything to gatherings that I host. It doesn't really bother me, because I realize their standards are different. But I would feel completely rude and unmannerly if I didn't bring something. It's not even a family dynamic, since my own family doesn't expect it.. my mother just added it to her "basic manners" lesson, along with saying thank you and chewing with your mouth closed.

I understand what you are saying but that is where I just view family as being in a different category usually. I would never open the fridge at someone's house and help myself to a drink - I was taught that is "basic manners" but it is not bad manners for me to open my parents' fridge or my in-laws' fridge and get a drink. It may be bad manners in other people's families but my point was just that "good manners" or "etiquette" doesn't carry over from society in general to family relationships. Or maybe you are saying it does? Would you help yourself to a drink in the fridge at a dinner party before one is offered? would you at your parents' house? maybe for you, all those "basic manners" rules do carry over but I think it is fair to say that isn't the case in many families.

I always ask before helping myself to a cupboard or fridge. However, if there's no one around to ask then obviously I just do it. And since that means that sometimes I'm hanging out at my in-laws when they aren't in the room (or sometimes aren't actually home), there are SOME rules of basic etiquette that I break.

[Chloe'sMommy]

Question: If you're asked to bring something (like dessert) is it bad etiquette to bring a pre-made pie if you can't/don't know how to bake one?

I don't think that's bad manners, no.

I do think there are certain rules that transcend all situations. For instance you don't take seconds before everyone's had firsts. Things like burping and talking about poop at the table are situational though.

[Chloe'sMommy]

Good. We're going to a new friend's home for dinner and I offered to bring something so she asked if I'd bring some dessert. I know everyone (except for me it seems) likes pumpkin pie so I was just going to buy a pre-made one, but I didn't want people to look at me weird =P I can't make pie. I suck.

pumpkin pie is pretty easy. You can get already spiced pie filling and a premade crust. =P Or get a can of pumpkin and follow the directions on the can. Not that I'm saying it's wrong to not make the pie yourself - I don't think it matters. But it's probably cheaper to make it yourself. I don't really know, since I have to make a Vegan Pumpkin pie this year. My Thanksgiving cooking is going to be complicated, lol.

[Chloe'sMommy]

You're making a vegan Thanksgiving? Sounds rough!

[~Kris~]

Here's a simple and yummy pumpkin bar: Get a spice cake mix, a can of pumpkin. Mix the 2 together, pour into a 13x9 pan and bake for 30 minutes. EASY!!!

My family is different than most it seems: the person hosting the event takes care of almost everything. But my grandma does bring pies for Thanksgiving and my mom does the rest.

[Chloe'sMommy]

That is really easy!

Originally Posted by Chloe'sMommy

You're making a vegan Thanksgiving? Sounds rough!

There's gonna be some Vegan-Friendly dishes, but there will definitely still be turkey!

Originally Posted by Keskes

There's gonna be some Vegan-Friendly dishes, but there will definitely still be turkey!

I would dry hump any host who provided a veg'n-friendly dish.

[Calendula]

Originally Posted by Tofu Bacon

I would dry hump any host who provided a veg'n-friendly dish.

I thought I was gonna get some action, then I remembered the dishes I made had either honey or a little bit of cream in them. Dang it.

I didn't realize honey wasn't vegan friendly? interesting. I just googled "vegan ___" and followed the recipes, lol. And I lied - there wasn't turkey, there was ham.

[melkissa2004]

We just had Thanksgiving at our house with family and this is how it worked: about a week before, my mom and sister and I all discussed which dishes we would make. I did 75%, my mom did about 20% and my sister did about 5%. They offered to help and even if they hadn't, I probably would have asked them to bring at least a dish each. Now if it was a dinner party with friends, I wouldn't ask for any help. If someone offered, I would probably give them something small to bring but that's it. I think it's different with family though.

Originally Posted by Calendula

I thought I was gonna get some action, then I remembered the dishes I made had either honey or a little bit of cream in them. Dang it.

There's always Christmas...