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when is stopping non custodial visitation okay?

Forum: Heated Debates


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June 15th, 2010, 06:19 AM
stardusthealer's Avatar Super Mommy
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: New Brunswick, Canada
Posts: 642
Is there ever a time when you think it is okay to disallow a biofather visitation with the kids? Here is a little background info. without getting into most of the drama. My x and I separated in April 2009 he moved in his gf a week later. I moved out in August 2009 and back to my home town. We do not have a custody agreement but i have full custody of the kids. I told him before I left he could see them every 2 weeks and could talk to them on the phone whenever he wanted to.
In Sept.2009(Labour day) he had them for 4 days, the kids called in tears everyday. Then he had them in October for 3 days for Thanksgiving. He had them again the week before Christmas. Then he didn't see them again until the middle of April which was our dd's birthday. He sees them only when he feels like it and can go months without talking to them. I have talked to him 2 times this month and both times I asked if he wanted to talk to the kids and he said NO not right now, even though he hadn't talk to them in over a month. My x lives 3 hours away.
In the mist of all this My 8 yr old and 6 yr old are acting out majorly and after anytime with their dad or his mother i get 2 weeks of he!1 from the boys. My 8 yr old son gets in trouble at school a lot because he is so angry and my 6 yr old acts out not as much but he follows suit with Ty. My 8yr old just got kicked off the bus for his behaviour. Its to the point where when i see the school's number on my phone i cringe cause I know that its because of Ty's behaviour. The kids all see the guidance counsellor as well. On top of all this My 8 yr old has dyslexia and adhd and possible odd and ocd as well as ptsd. my 6 yr old has add and dyslexia and possibly ptsd. My 8 yr old is finally seeing a counsellor this Thursday and my 6 yr old we are still waiting.

when does it become okay to disallow visitation due to the fact that there is no consistency and it causes turmoil within our home?

  1. Mom to Arielle13,Tyler 10.5, Dylan 8.5 and Autumn Rayne 21mths and Step dd Nevaeh 3

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June 15th, 2010, 06:26 AM
WineKeepsMeSane's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: May 2007
Location: where chili has beans
Posts: 13,348
When it is affecting the health of the kids, you do what's best for the kids. They need consistency, and it sounds like their father is the opposite of that. They need help in sorting through their feelings on that, and in dealing with it. You can help by shielding them from it as much as possible, and by making the rest of their life stable.

Just my two cents.
Ashley, mommy to Mackenzie 01/01/08

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June 15th, 2010, 10:58 AM
*Dayna*'s Avatar Aussie Mama
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,329
Sounds to me, that if I was in that situation I'd be cutting off visitation. It isn't any good for anyone. I'm sorry he doesn't give a S... about his children. That has to be so tough on you
Nothing is better than being with your family. Finally reunited after 5 long months <3
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June 15th, 2010, 11:28 AM
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by Mommiex2 View Post
You have no court order, therefore you don't have to let your ex see the kids. I doubt any judge would allow your ex to have him for overnights when he doesn't see them on a regular basis. So, if he wants scheduled visitation, let him ask the court for it, and then you can bring your counselors to court (or their notes) so the court can see what a disruption your ex is in their lives.

I would concentrate on getting the kids in counseling stat. Perhaps even have someone work with you to help you deal with their behavior needs.

Ditto this. If it's not in writing you're not obligated to give him anything. I wouldn't withhold just for being mean but it doesn't sound like that's your motive.
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June 15th, 2010, 11:55 AM
Posts: n/a
To put it simply, if visitation is doing more harm then good, then it should stop.
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June 15th, 2010, 01:20 PM
MissTorrieIfYou'reNasty's Avatar Co-Host of Heated Debates
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Green-Vegas South Carolina!
Posts: 4,805
Yeah, doesn't sound like this guy is going to be especially motivated to push the issue, so I would stop pushing it too. Don't make some Grand Proclamation that you're not letting the kids have access to him anymore, but do stop pushing the issue with him.

In case he is compelled to push the issue at some point, document now. Document with the counselors, make sure you have proof that their behavior could benefit more from consistency and stability and that their father does not provide that. Then do what's best for your kids and **** what anyone else thinks.

I wish you and your boys the best of luck in the future. I was a difficult child with multiple learning disabilities and behavior problems, and I am not a maniac or a drooling idiot. My parents loved me unconditionally, and I think that's part of it.

"I love mankind, it's people I can't stand."
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June 15th, 2010, 07:12 PM
KrazE's Avatar ShutTheFrontDoor
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,546
Whew, ok I had to do a quick hunt because NB Family Law has a few different aspects than in Ontario so.. (though this really belongs in a different forum & not debates!)

Firstly, what you have is called de facto custody and hard to enforce if your ex decides to take the children. The police can recommend that he return them to you, but in absence of a court order, there isn't a lot they can really do.
That being said, you can take a FREE course offered in NB called “For the Sake of the Children”, you can register by calling the Family Law Information Line at 1-888-236-2444.

Now, because you have de facto custody, you can legally refuse his access to the children; it does not matter if you're doing it out of spite or not (unfortunately). The police also cannot force you to let him take the kids, there is no enforceable court order (AND unless your order explicitly lists the ability of having police involvement even on a final order, they tend to not want to become mixed up in these types of disputes).

Both parents have a right to custody in absence of a court order, so either of you can apply (what happens on the outcome is not quite the same though)

Another very important factor is called Status Quo. Your ex's visitation/contact or lack thereof will also be factored during a custody hearing.
It would also be quite difficult for him to deem you an unfit parent (unless there were legal or Children's Services issues that hinted at a problem). His actions (you having the kids & him being an almost non-existent parent) tells the court that he feels you are capable of raising the children.

There are 3 ways to decide custody; you can both agree on an arrangement, you can go to mediation, or you can ask the court to decide.

If/when you decide to get a custody order in place, your request should be for sole custody with planned visitation thought out beforehand as best as you can; the courts are favourable to those that try to work with the best interest of the children in mind.
Sole custody allows you to make medical, educational and religious decisions for the children without the father's input; and when his actions show that he has not been involved in these matters anyway, courts are likely to award this (at least in Canada).
If he is mindful of their needs as you would expect a parent to be, then they might award joint custody - this does not mean their time is split between homes (which is called split custody), it simply gives equal rights (sort of) to both parents in regards to the decisions for the child(ren), but, ultimately one parent's decision is final (the parent who has primary custody - which is the parent where the children live for more than 60% of their time). The primary parent must be reasonable when it comes to the decision making process, and if they are not, the other parent will be able to have the court order modified which will work against the primary custodial parent.

This is already becoming a book in the wrong forum for this sort of topic, unless you wanted it to be debated

Please note that the information I provided will not be the same for all Provinces or Countries, and I am also not a lawyer, but I do know Family Law quite well because I learned it to represent myself in my own battle.

All the best to you & the kids!

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