Log In Sign Up

My way or the highway


Forum: Heated Debates

Notices

Welcome to the JustMommies Message Boards.

We pride ourselves on having the friendliest and most welcoming forums for moms and moms to be! Please take a moment and register for free so you can be a part of our growing community of mothers. If you have any problems registering please drop an email to [email protected].

Our community is moderated by our moderation team so you won't see spam or offensive messages posted on our forums. Each of our message boards is hosted by JustMommies hosts, whose names are listed at the top each board. We hope you find our message boards friendly, helpful, and fun to be on!

View Poll Results: Just curious
Only people with the same religion as me will go to heaven 8 27.59%
All religions lead the way to god 10 34.48%
I am an atheist/agnostic and just want to see the poll 11 37.93%
Voters: 29. You may not vote on this poll

Reply Post New Topic
  Subscribe To Heated Debates LinkBack Topic Tools Search this Topic Display Modes
  #1  
July 7th, 2006, 10:39 PM
kadydid
Guest
Posts: n/a
Do you think your religion is the only way? Like if your Muslim do you think that is the ONLY way you can go to heaven, and every one else is going to the other place. Or if you are Christian do you think that Jesus is the only way to heaven and there really is no other way?

Or do you think there is truth in all religions and that Hindu's and Buddhists will walk with Christians and Muslims in heaven.

I am really bored tonight LOL
Reply With Quote
  #2  
July 7th, 2006, 10:47 PM
chlodoll
Guest
Posts: n/a
I would like to think that all religions lead to heaven. If someone is a good person their whole life but goto hell for following the wrong religion seems unfair. People are born into religions. People follow what they are taught. I would hope that God would forgive someone for following the wrong path but doing it the best they could.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
July 8th, 2006, 12:10 AM
mrobinson
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
I would like to think that all religions lead to heaven. I would hope that God would forgive someone for following the wrong path but doing it the best they could.[/b]
Reply With Quote
  #4  
July 8th, 2006, 03:37 AM
Cereal Killer's Avatar Aiming for mediocrity
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: in my house
Posts: 7,374
I have been raised a Catholic and to believe that Jesus is the only way to Heaven, I have trouble believing that though.
I, personally, don't think God cares what he is called whether it be God, Allah, Buddah, or Joe as long as there is the belief that he exists, KWIM? I believe in a forgiving God, and as long as we are all good people and live our lives accordingly then we will all go to Heaven.
I do not see how only one religion could be the only way, because our religion is largely determined by our familiy, our culture and our location. If Christianity is the only way to heaven, then how is the Aboriginee (sp) in Africa supposed to obtain the proper information to convert and "save his soul"? For that matter, how is Suzie down the street, who's parents are Atheist and taught her their beliefs supposed to become saved. If this alternate, non-Christian religion is all someone knows or the only spirituality taught, then how can they be expected to learn otherwise?

I think that God wants us all to be good people, and I think (I hope) that is the only requirement to get into Heaven.
__________________
Wife, Mother of 4, Homeschooling, and wine drinking.


Reply With Quote
  #5  
July 8th, 2006, 11:00 AM
Momo's Avatar Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Washington
Posts: 8,736
Quote:
I think that God wants us all to be good people, and I think (I hope) that is the only requirement to get into Heaven.[/b]

If this is the case the Bible and Jesus' sacrifice was the biggest waste of time and life there ever was.
The big difference between all other religions and Christianity is every other single one is based on what we do, being good enough, praying enough, converting enough people....but that is not what the Bible teaches. Christianity teahes that it's not what we do but rather what God did. His sacrificial grace is what saves you.
If it's his sacrificial grace that saves than all of the others that teach that we have to do stuff too are simply wrong. And if those others are right and it does matter what we do, that we have to get there based on our own merits and ideas, than Christianity is totally wrong.
Everything can't be right. It just can't. It sounds nice to say so but people often decieve themselves to make themselves feel better.
__________________
~Sara~



Clara's here! 5/13/11

I love my two handsome boys!!!
Jetty - 8/06
Jude - 9/08


Reply With Quote
  #6  
July 8th, 2006, 11:17 AM
Cereal Killer's Avatar Aiming for mediocrity
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: in my house
Posts: 7,374
Quote:
Quote:

I think that God wants us all to be good people, and I think (I hope) that is the only requirement to get into Heaven.[/b]

If this is the case the Bible and Jesus' sacrifice was the biggest waste of time and life there ever was.
The big difference between all other religions and Christianity is every other single one is based on what we do, being good enough, praying enough, converting enough people....but that is not what the Bible teaches. Christianity teahes that it's not what we do but rather what God did. His sacrificial grace is what saves you.
If it's his sacrificial grace that saves than all of the others that teach that we have to do stuff too are simply wrong. And if those others are right and it does matter what we do, that we have to get there based on our own merits and ideas, than Christianity is totally wrong.
Everything can't be right. It just can't. It sounds nice to say so but people often decieve themselves to make themselves feel better.
[/b]
Okay, then here is where I question it:
What about those in third world countries or tribes, or caves (you get the idea), who have no access, knowledge or education of Christianity, are they [email protected] to he11 because they had no way of knowing or learning of Jesus? What about the child who was brought up in the "wrong" religion, he was never taught anything different, why is that his fault? Why is God going to fault a person that He created who never learned of His Grace or who was never told the story of His Son's ultimate sacrifice?
I choose to believe in a forgiving God. If we were supposed to be perfect, God would have made us so. He didn't, He made us human, He made us fallible, He gave us free will. If He wanted us all the same, wouldn't He have made us that way? If He wanted us to all believe the same, wouldn't He have given the entire world the knowledge of His existance and the materials to know Him and His story better.
__________________
Wife, Mother of 4, Homeschooling, and wine drinking.


Reply With Quote
  #7  
July 8th, 2006, 11:19 AM
Platinum Supermommy
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 6,149
Quote:
Quote:

I think that God wants us all to be good people, and I think (I hope) that is the only requirement to get into Heaven.[/b]

If this is the case the Bible and Jesus' sacrifice was the biggest waste of time and life there ever was.
The big difference between all other religions and Christianity is every other single one is based on what we do, being good enough, praying enough, converting enough people....but that is not what the Bible teaches. Christianity teahes that it's not what we do but rather what God did. His sacrificial grace is what saves you.
If it's his sacrificial grace that saves than all of the others that teach that we have to do stuff too are simply wrong. And if those others are right and it does matter what we do, that we have to get there based on our own merits and ideas, than Christianity is totally wrong.
Everything can't be right. It just can't. It sounds nice to say so but people often decieve themselves to make themselves feel better.
[/b]
I don't think I'm following you here. But what I get is that in Christianity, it doesn't matter what people do, that God's grace gets someone into Heaven? So, I can be good (or bad) and it doesn't affect whether I make it into Heaven or not? Maybe I'm misunderstanding?
__________________
~Amber~

Reply With Quote
  #9  
July 8th, 2006, 12:59 PM
mrobinson
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Everything can't be right. It just can't. It sounds nice to say so but people often decieve themselves to make themselves feel better.[/b]
Or is that people have become so narrow minded in their beliefs they forget God's bigger picture is impossible for a mere mortal to understand?

Quote:
I am no good at debating religon because honestly I am pretty ignorant to it. I just wanted to state my opinion, which I really wish I could word what I'm trying to say better.[/b]
That's how I feel most of the time!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
July 8th, 2006, 01:42 PM
kadydid
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:

I think that God wants us all to be good people, and I think (I hope) that is the only requirement to get into Heaven.[/b]

If this is the case the Bible and Jesus' sacrifice was the biggest waste of time and life there ever was.
The big difference between all other religions and Christianity is every other single one is based on what we do, being good enough, praying enough, converting enough people....but that is not what the Bible teaches. Christianity teahes that it's not what we do but rather what God did. His sacrificial grace is what saves you.
If it's his sacrificial grace that saves than all of the others that teach that we have to do stuff too are simply wrong. And if those others are right and it does matter what we do, that we have to get there based on our own merits and ideas, than Christianity is totally wrong.
Everything can't be right. It just can't. It sounds nice to say so but people often decieve themselves to make themselves feel better.
[/b]
Okay, then here is where I question it:
What about those in third world countries or tribes, or caves (you get the idea), who have no access, knowledge or education of Christianity, are they [email protected] to he11 because they had no way of knowing or learning of Jesus? What about the child who was brought up in the "wrong" religion, he was never taught anything different, why is that his fault? Why is God going to fault a person that He created who never learned of His Grace or who was never told the story of His Son's ultimate sacrifice?
I choose to believe in a forgiving God. If we were supposed to be perfect, God would have made us so. He didn't, He made us human, He made us fallible, He gave us free will. If He wanted us all the same, wouldn't He have made us that way? If He wanted us to all believe the same, wouldn't He have given the entire world the knowledge of His existance and the materials to know Him and His story better.
[/b]
This is what I have a hard time understanding too. Or what about the missionaries who go to other counties to try to convert and the people there are into their own religion (imagine if people from other countries tried to change your ideas on religion) and if they don't believe them or agree with them they are in trouble for that too. I don't see how that could be the case, their only crime is really just being born on the wrong side of the earth.

Hell has always been the kicker for me. It sounds okay on a small scale, like Hitler went to hell, but on a large scale it doesn't make sense to me. kwim?? That is a lot of people going to hell if only Muslims are right or only Christians are right, it seems like a really big waste of life.

Quote:
My dads side of the family is catholic, my moms side is baptist. Where as I consider myself a hopeful agnostic. I do not know for sure that god does or doesn't exist, nobody knows FOR SURE. I do hope he does but I just don't feel certian about it either way. Sometimes I think I believe but other times I feel like religon is just wishful thinking to make it easier to cope with death.

However, I believe that if he does exist, as long as you are a good and decent person there should be no reason you would not get into heaven. If he is really real, he is supposedly a forgiving being, so how can he not let people in becuase they are the incorrect religion? If he wanted everyone to follow the same religion don't you think he would have some way of letting us know which is the correct one to follow?

I am no good at debating religon because honestly I am pretty ignorant to it. I just wanted to state my opinion, which I really wish I could word what I'm trying to say better.[/b]
You're opinion is just as good as any elses! And that is all this pretty much is, is just a bunch of opinions floating around. None will know for sure until the end, so really you are no more ignorant than anyone else. (me included) I have my own views on after life and god, I think we all believe in something that we think is right and just. At least I hope we all believe in something that is good.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
July 8th, 2006, 05:11 PM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,496
A Christian ( I do not know what denomination they were, but they were pretty fundamental) once argued to me that Jesus was, indeed, the only way to salvation but that they do missionary work in order to spread the word so that there would be no community without the chance to accept Jesus as their savior.

They couldn't answer me this question:

"If Jesus is the only way to salvation, why is it that these communities removed from Christianity have to depend on missionaries for their salvation? Isn't that contradictory?"
__________________
taking jm breaks if you don't see me around much
Reply With Quote
  #12  
July 8th, 2006, 08:22 PM
NaynayPie's Avatar Super Mommy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Hiding somewhere in IL
Posts: 986
I bet no one would ever guess which choice I voted for

~Nay
__________________
<div align="center"><span style="font-family:Book Antiqua">[b]I'm A
Natural Birthing, Delayed-Vaxing, Sleep Sharing, Baby Wearing, Tandem Breastfeeding, Cloth Diapering, Never Spanking Mama to two Beautiful, Healthy and Intact Little Babies
</div>
Reply With Quote
  #13  
July 10th, 2006, 08:40 AM
Regular
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 4
Quote:
"If Jesus is the only way to salvation, why is it that these communities removed from Christianity have to depend on missionaries for their salvation? Isn't that contradictory?[/b]
God reveals himself to everyone, regardless of their knowledge or lack of knowledge of the scriptures. They don't depend on missionaries. God uses missionaries to proclaim the gospel message, but if someone is missed it doesn't mean they are lost.

If some person in remote has never heard the gospel message, he will be judged according to what he knows. God created everything and everyone. He doesn't depend on US to do his work for him.

On the other hand, people who HAVE heard the gospel and have rejected the ultimate sacrifice made for them, that is another story. They too will be judged according to what they KNOW. Everyone has a chance in life to accept or reject Christ and God's revealed knowledge to them. It is up to them to decide.

Yes, I am in the camp that Christ is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE, and that NO ONE comes to the father but through the Son.
__________________
Nicole


Reply With Quote
  #14  
July 10th, 2006, 08:45 AM
Mega Super Mommy
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,496
That I can accept. There is no punishment for ignorance. That is fair and tolerant in my mind and something that I would expect from a loving God.
__________________
taking jm breaks if you don't see me around much
Reply With Quote
  #15  
July 10th, 2006, 09:25 AM
kadydid
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE
Quote:
"If Jesus is the only way to salvation, why is it that these communities removed from Christianity have to depend on missionaries for their salvation? Isn't that contradictory?[/b]
God reveals himself to everyone, regardless of their knowledge or lack of knowledge of the scriptures. They don't depend on missionaries. God uses missionaries to proclaim the gospel message, but if someone is missed it doesn't mean they are lost.

If some person in remote has never heard the gospel message, he will be judged according to what he knows. God created everything and everyone. He doesn't depend on US to do his work for him.

On the other hand, people who HAVE heard the gospel and have rejected the ultimate sacrifice made for them, that is another story. They too will be judged according to what they KNOW. Everyone has a chance in life to accept or reject Christ and God's revealed knowledge to them. It is up to them to decide.

Yes, I am in the camp that Christ is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE, and that NO ONE comes to the father but through the Son.
[/b][/quote]
Boy that’s an allover the place statement. So NO ONE can get to the father without Jesus BUT everyone else will be judged on what they know?? If Christ is the ONLY way the second part of that makes no sense, because there are really good people in all religions and belief systems. So if they are judged on what they know and they are really good people then Jesus would not be the only way. kwim?

Wouldn’t people who do missionary work be doing people a disservice? Seriously wouldn’t it be better for them not to spread the word and let the innocent just continue to be innocent? Instead of going to countries were they don’t practice Christianity and telling them the “good news”? If they don’t believe them and choose to stay with their own religion they are rejecting Christ.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
July 10th, 2006, 10:00 AM
Cereal Killer's Avatar Aiming for mediocrity
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: in my house
Posts: 7,374
Quote:
Quote:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE
<div class='quotemain'>"If Jesus is the only way to salvation, why is it that these communities removed from Christianity have to depend on missionaries for their salvation? Isn't that contradictory?[/b]
God reveals himself to everyone, regardless of their knowledge or lack of knowledge of the scriptures. They don't depend on missionaries. God uses missionaries to proclaim the gospel message, but if someone is missed it doesn't mean they are lost.

If some person in remote has never heard the gospel message, he will be judged according to what he knows. God created everything and everyone. He doesn't depend on US to do his work for him.

On the other hand, people who HAVE heard the gospel and have rejected the ultimate sacrifice made for them, that is another story. They too will be judged according to what they KNOW. Everyone has a chance in life to accept or reject Christ and God's revealed knowledge to them. It is up to them to decide.

Yes, I am in the camp that Christ is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE, and that NO ONE comes to the father but through the Son.
[/b][/quote]
Boy that’s an allover the place statement. So NO ONE can get to the father without Jesus BUT everyone else will be judged on what they know?? If Christ is the ONLY way the second part of that makes no sense, because there are really good people in all religions and belief systems. So if they are judged on what they know and they are really good people then Jesus would not be the only way. kwim?

Wouldn’t people who do missionary work be doing people a disservice? Seriously wouldn’t it be better for them not to spread the word and let the innocent just continue to be innocent? Instead of going to countries were they don’t practice Christianity and telling them the “good news”? If they don’t believe them and choose to stay with their own religion they are rejecting Christ.
[/b][/quote]

I have to agree, I was thinking that was a bit contradictory while I was reading it too. Why would God have a different set of rules based on geography? Why is it only someone in a remote corner of the jungle will be judged on their knowledge but Joe Public in the US who was brought up Atheist, and that is what he knows is going to he11?
I have a very strongth belief in God and Jesus Christ and the sacrifice that was made for our sins. I also choose to believe in a loving, forgiving God. God did not make man infallible, or incapable of sin. I don't understand why He would have made us so imperfect with the expectation of us being so perfect. I believe, I try to live a good life, but, I make mistakes, I sin, I am not perfect and never will be.
__________________
Wife, Mother of 4, Homeschooling, and wine drinking.


Reply With Quote
  #17  
July 10th, 2006, 10:05 AM
mrobinson
Guest
Posts: n/a
((ot- When I first got here, no one would question it.. now I read lots of people asking it.. I'm so glad for it.))
Reply With Quote
  #18  
July 10th, 2006, 10:39 AM
kadydid
Guest
Posts: n/a
So I went and looked up what the pro’s at got questions had to say about the subject from a biblical point of view. I was almost embarrassed to see one of their statements because it was very similar to what I had said about why would they even need missionaries, wouldn’t it be better if they didn’t say anything if that were the case? (I wanted to bring this article up also because I don’t want anyone to think that I would copy someone’s comments. That was my own “original” thought)

They said this. (They try to answer things from a biblical POV)

Quote:
All people are accountable to God whether they have “heard about Him” or not. The Bible tells us that God has clearly revealed Himself in nature (Romans 1:20) and in the hearts of people (Ecclesiastes 3:11). The problem is that the human race is sinful; we all reject this knowledge of God and rebel against Him (Romans 1:21-23). Apart from God's grace, God would give us over to the sinful desires of our hearts, allowing us to discover how useless and miserable life is apart from Him. This He does for those who reject Him (Romans 1:24-32).[/b]
Quote:
Instead of debating the fate of those who have never heard, we, as Christians, should be doing our best to make sure that they hear. We are called to spread the Gospel throughout the nations (Matthew 28:19-20; Acts 1:8). The fact that we know people reject the knowledge of God revealed in nature must motivate us to proclaim the good news of salvation through Jesus Christ. Only through accepting the Gospel of God’s grace through the Lord Jesus Christ can people be saved from their sins and rescued from an eternity apart from God in hell.[/b]
Quote:
If we assume that those who never hear the Gospel are granted mercy from God, we will run into a terrible problem. If people who never hear the Gospel are saved…we should make sure that no one ever hears the Gospel. The worst thing we could do would be share the Gospel with a person and have him or her reject it. If that were to happen, he or she would be condemned. People who do not hear the Gospel must be condemned, or else there is no motive for evangelism. Why run the risk of people possibly rejecting the Gospel and condemning themselves – when they were previously saved because they had never heard the Gospel?[/b]
http://www.gotquestions.org/never-heard.html


(I think my quoter is broke. There is more at the link about this subject)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
July 10th, 2006, 10:47 AM
Cereal Killer's Avatar Aiming for mediocrity
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: in my house
Posts: 7,374
So, does it matter what other people, cultures or religions call God? It would be easy to assume for most, by looking around the world and at nature and in our hearts that there is a higher power, that there is God. I have often wondered, though, that if the requirement is only knowing and understanding his existance then why does it matter what name he is called. Why would God care if he is called God, Allah, Buddah, or John as long as we believe and acknowledge his existance and all that he has granted us through life, and nature?
__________________
Wife, Mother of 4, Homeschooling, and wine drinking.


Reply With Quote
  #20  
July 10th, 2006, 10:50 AM
mrobinson
Guest
Posts: n/a
Quote:
So, does it matter what other people, cultures or religions call God? It would be easy to assume for most, by looking around the world and at nature and in our hearts that there is a higher power, that there is God. I have often wondered, though, that if the requirement is only knowing and understanding his existance then why does it matter what name he is called. Why would God care if he is called God, Allah, Buddah, or John as long as we believe and acknowledge his existance and all that he has granted us through life, and nature?[/b]
Exactly, He wouldn't.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Topic Tools Search this Topic
Search this Topic:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:42 AM.